Discussion - My Return to Norrath (1 Viewer)

[RGTorv]

Hi, all.

I'm a returning player from 2001-2006 (Velious through Darkhollow, basically). I remember the world feeling huge (and scary to attempt things like crossing the Karanas to get to Queynos). I really enjoyed single group content like LDoN, DoN, MPG Trials and such, but eventually struggled to find capable group and moved on to other interests.

I just recently came back just to look briefly around for nostalgia, but ended up finding it pretty fun and decided to stick around. I started with one character, then two, then three, then set up ISBoxer to help manage it, and now I am trying four f2p newbies (WAR, SHM, BRD, MAG) coming up together on a live server. Being able to form a group and enjoy the group strategy without all the work of LFG has been great. And of course, it led me here.

I watched the VV introductory videos and read through some of the manual and it looks like a great piece of software. My thought is to start modestly, and just run KissAssist or RGMercs on the bard who I currently struggle to play very well when CC is needed and I am busy doing everything else. Then, I can add add more help as I decide I need it, like maybe a shaman script to keep these buffs up since I rarely notice when they fade, or so on. Does it work okay to only run macros on one or two characters in a group? Would a bard running KA actually mez adds for me? It seems almost too good to be true.

I was also curious to maybe try it out with some melee DPS characters, who I had otherwise considered too difficult to box effectively at my skill level, though since I probably won't subscribe my DPS characters beyond once or twice for AA autogrant, I am now thinking I should stick to casters since they need prestige gear less.

Anyway, I just wanted to say hi and share some of my thoughts as I get started. Thanks for these great tools and the supportive community behind them!

-Torv

 

[Sic]

Welcome back to eq and welcome to RedGuides

Getting Started / Returning user

Welcome to RedGuides, fellow EQ multi-boxing enthusiast!

The best place to begin is our "New User Guide" video series, click this TV to watch:


This step-by-step series will teach absolute beginners how to control 6 characters at once while highlighting Nav, AutoLogin, and DanNet, which are fundamental plugins that will enhance every aspect of your game.

Returning users check out - MacroQuest Release Party: https://www.redguides.com/community/threads/macroquest-release-party.80628/ for information about changes from the legacy MQ2 to the new and awesome MQ

 

[Robban]

Hi, all.

I'm a returning player from 2001-2006 (Velious through Darkhollow, basically). I remember the world feeling huge (and scary to attempt things like crossing the Karanas to get to Queynos). I really enjoyed single group content like LDoN, DoN, MPG Trials and such, but eventually struggled to find capable group and moved on to other interests.

I just recently came back just to look briefly around for nostalgia, but ended up finding it pretty fun and decided to stick around. I started with one character, then two, then three, then set up ISBoxer to help manage it, and now I am trying four f2p newbies (WAR, SHM, BRD, MAG) coming up together on a live server. Being able to form a group and enjoy the group strategy without all the work of LFG has been great. And of course, it led me here.

I watched the VV introductory videos and read through some of the manual and it looks like a great piece of software. My thought is to start modestly, and just run KissAssist or RGMercs on the bard who I currently struggle to play very well when CC is needed and I am busy doing everything else. Then, I can add add more help as I decide I need it, like maybe a shaman script to keep these buffs up since I rarely notice when they fade, or so on. Does it work okay to only run macros on one or two characters in a group? Would a bard running KA actually mez adds for me? It seems almost too good to be true.

I was also curious to maybe try it out with some melee DPS characters, who I had otherwise considered too difficult to box effectively at my skill level, though since I probably won't subscribe my DPS characters beyond once or twice for AA autogrant, I am now thinking I should stick to casters since they need prestige gear less.

Anyway, I just wanted to say hi and share some of my thoughts as I get started. Thanks for these great tools and the supportive community behind them!

-Torv

Welcome!

 

[2ndGoat]

I was also curious to maybe try it out with some melee DPS characters, who I had otherwise considered too difficult to box effectively at my skill level, though since I probably won't subscribe my DPS characters beyond once or twice for AA autogrant, I am now thinking I should stick to casters since they need prestige gear less.

Melee groups work great, but if you're using automation in a non-instanced zone and someone wanders by, it's usually pretty easy to tell what you're up to. Other than being able to run much better with non-prestige gear at max AA, a big benefit of caster groups is they just sit on their ponies and blow stuff up.
My main crew is melee, but I stick mostly to instanced zones or out of the way places. It's really a matter of how you want to play, what you like to play, and then you just adjust your - let's call it "visibility" - to the outside world accordingly.

 

[Psy]

Welcome to RG and welcome back if you're a returning player!

Always start here RG Video

Watch the vids in Sic's signature (I'm sure he will post soon if he has not done so already while I'm typing this).

Once you have an idea of how things work, you'll want to look into some automation options. Check out Kissassist Beginners Guide, Kissassist Commands , RGmercs, and especially cwtn plugins ( you can also /testcopy your toons and use the cwtn plugins there for free and you'll want to spend some time looking at CWTN Plugins Explained.).

I suggest getting your feet wet slowly and be patient as it takes time to absorb all this information. Try taking your toons somewhere safe and lower level at first and explore the automation options. It takes some time to get used to, so don't be surprised it if feels overwhelming at first.

Once you feel like your're getting the hang of it (or to get a more in depth idea of what this site can do), then check out the macros and lua's available to complement your automation. Things like buttonmaster, mq2autogroup, MQ2Autoaccept, MQ2Status, GuildClicky, Boxhud, and more. You'll also want to see Lua event manager.

How do you get to see and experience all of this you ask? You need to be a level 2 member. To do that you have 2 options. First, you can subscribe (paid method) or second, you can use Red Cents. What the heck is a Red Cent you ask? Red Cents can you help with your subscription and it's the currency this site uses. Contribute helpful information (post here) and others will give you red cents and each red cent you give others returns one to you. check it out! Red Cents

Time to subscribe to level 2 and begin a journey you won't regret. Lots of info and a super helpful community here to help when you get stuck.

 

[fuggun]

Welcome back to EQ. I also just recently found RG's. I wish I would have found this group before I quit EQ the first time. you won't regret.

 

[Doc James]

Welcome!

 

[Beastmann]

Welcome to RedGuides!

 

[Wraith6911]

Welcome back to EQ, and welcome to RG

 

[RGTorv]

I thought I'd write an update of how the experience has gone for me so far, in case it might be helpful to anyone else thinking of taking the plunge. With the generous amount of redcents given to my first post, I was able to subscribe to level 2 access.

I started off watching the New User video series that Sic linked all the way through, then I watched each video again and tried to follow along. Installation went smoothly, and the only hiccup was that the Follow Me and Come to Me buttons introduced in video 3 didn't seem to work until I updated the NavMesh as described in Video 4. Those buttons, and the related ability to automatically navigate a character or a group to any location in the Find window (or even to another zone with the /travelto command) are like magic and probably my favorite part of this tool so far.

I then tried to use RGMercs and have had a lot of trouble with it, probably due to my own misunderstanding. I ran the install command, formed my group, set my group roles, and then ran /rgstart and everything seemed to work. The characters would change their spells and do some buffing. I could make them pull on command, and chase me. However in combat they would often sit around doing nothing. Sometimes they would engage immediately, sometimes long into the fight, and sometimes not at all. I eventually figured out that the /killnow command would force them to engage, but even then after a few seconds some of them would stop attacking, and I would have to issue the command multiple times per fight. The BL did not ever send in his pet.

I tried KissAssist and had better luck with it, though I think the flexibility and customizability that makes it appealing is also a bit of a downside, relative to RGMercs, at low levels where you change spells and abilities rapidly. Following the instructions in the KA Manual I got my characters behaving as expected, assisting mostly at the specified time, casting what I asked them to cast. Seeing my bard pull and CC automatically was exciting and I could imagine really tweaking the ini settings to my liking once I get higher level. But again I would have problems with characters engaging. Sometimes when my bard pulled, my tank would shoot out and intercept the mob right as it entered the camp with perfect timing. Sometimes he would just sit there for 10 seconds and then engage. Sometimes I gave up waiting and made him and the other characters engage manually. They seemed to do attack properly for the rest of the fight once I did that, but I am not sure if it was KA doing it or just EQMelee kicking in to keep them sticking to the mobs and spamming some kicks and whatnot.

Could it be that my computer is struggling with 6 clients and these macros are getting hung up and preventing my characters from engaging on time? It is a pretty old machine but the game seems otherwise responsive with 6 characters.

I also have some confusion about how roles are supposed to work. I tried automating my tank and playing it manually with everything else automated. It seems to want my tank to be the Main Assist, which seems wrong to me. Doesn't the tank need to rotate through mobs and get aggro and pick up adds and taunt things off people? It seems like he needs to change targets without everyone assisting him, so someone else should be the Main Assist. With my melee group I like the idea of /chaseon and the tank on hunter mode, but I remained unsure what roles to give my tank for this. I am hunting some cyclops which are unmezzable and so the tank is frequently changing targets when I have adds. How do most people set the roles for tank, puller, hunter, MA, etc?

Apologies for the wall of text, but hopefully my experiences are useful to some, and if any more veteran VV user made it through this post, I'd love to hear any thoughts or advice on the issues I was having. Thanks again for the great tool and the helpful community here.

 

[Psy]

Glad you're diving in and getting the hang of it. Best advice I have here is a ton of patience. If I have learned anything it's that getting used to this software and all it can/can't do takes time, practice, and patience but based on your persistence, I'm confident you'll keep getting better.

I have never used RRMercs myself, so I imagine someone else here who is more knowledgeable can offer some advice there or check out the thread for rgmercs

But again I would have problems with characters engaging. Sometimes when my bard pulled, my tank would shoot out and intercept the mob right as it entered the camp with perfect timing. Sometimes he would just sit there for 10 seconds and then engage. Sometimes I gave up waiting and made him and the other characters engage manually. They seemed to do attack properly for the rest of the fight once I did that, but I am not sure if it was KA doing it or just EQMelee kicking in to keep them sticking to the mobs and spamming some kicks and whatnot.

Sounds like your tank camp radius is larger than you are expecting but if I understand correctly, it also sounds like you are pulling with a toon other than your MT and I found this problematic. My main was never the tank and I always struggled with pulling, agro, camp radius, etc. I ended up using the tank as my main and always have him as MT/MA. This allows you to use as much or as little automation as you like.
Mezzing is also a bit of a learning curve due to line of sight, camp radius, etc.

Could it be that my computer is struggling with 6 clients and these macros are getting hung up and preventing my characters from engaging on time? It is a pretty old machine but the game seems otherwise responsive with 6 characters.

Yes. Make sure to check out MQ2framelimiter and utilize it. Made a huge difference for me!

I also have some confusion about how roles are supposed to work. I tried automating my tank and playing it manually with everything else automated. It seems to want my tank to be the Main Assist, which seems wrong to me. Doesn't the tank need to rotate through mobs and get aggro and pick up adds and taunt things off people? It seems like he needs to change targets without everyone assisting him, so someone else should be the Main Assist. With my melee group I like the idea of /chaseon and the tank on hunter mode, but I remained unsure what roles to give my tank for this. I am hunting some cyclops which are unmezzable and so the tank is frequently changing targets when I have adds. How do most people set the roles for tank, puller, hunter, MA, etc?

The tank should always be the MT and while you can use another toon as MA, as I mentioned above it can complicate things. If you can drive with the tank, set them as MT/MA and all others on assist. This allows you to either run around and have the toons assist what you attack or they will attack when you pull a mob close enough to your camp. Make sure your camp radius is set to where you want it. The rings on the map will show you. One the tank brings the mob into the camps radius, and the other toons should assist.

I like the idea of /chaseon and the tank on hunter mode, but I remained unsure what roles to give my tank for this. I am hunting some cyclops which are unmezzable and so the tank is frequently changing targets when I have adds. How do most people set the roles for tank, puller, hunter, MA, etc?

MT/MA should be the correct roles. This allows the other toons to assist the tank when he engages. He is likely changing targets trying to get agro since it sounds like you have him running on automation.
Hunter tank mode is great but IMO, I would recommend not using it until you get familiar with pulling with your tank on your own. Drive the tank as MT/MA for a while and make sure the team is operating as designed. Hunter tank for me was another level of learning since the software does what it's programmed to do and you have to be able to manage both that and your team at the same time. I would recommend testing it in a much lower level zone like farming for pelts =). Less chance of death and allows you to see who the group runs.

 

[Robban]

I then tried to use RGMercs and have had a lot of trouble with it, probably due to my own misunderstanding. I ran the install command, formed my group, set my group roles, and then ran /rgstart and everything seemed to work. The characters would change their spells and do some buffing. I could make them pull on command, and chase me. However in combat they would often sit around doing nothing. Sometimes they would engage immediately, sometimes long into the fight, and sometimes not at all. I eventually figured out that the /killnow command would force them to engage, but even then after a few seconds some of them would stop attacking, and I would have to issue the command multiple times per fight. The BL did not ever send in his pet.

always be sure they are set to assist the right character. The plugin mq2status is super for this with a simple /bcga //status. Or try @pezak 's RGui here https://www.redguides.com/community/resources/rgui.2877/ that shows who you are assisting.

and starting with /rggroup on your tank (instead of /rgstart on everyone) will auto start everyone else in your group with the right assist btw

 

[Many_Whelps]

Could it be that my computer is struggling with 6 clients and these macros are getting hung up and preventing my characters from engaging on time? It is a pretty old machine but the game seems otherwise responsive with 6 characters.

I also have some confusion about how roles are supposed to work. I tried automating my tank and playing it manually with everything else automated. It seems to want my tank to be the Main Assist, which seems wrong to me. Doesn't the tank need to rotate through mobs and get aggro and pick up adds and taunt things off people? It seems like he needs to change targets without everyone assisting him, so someone else should be the Main Assist. With my melee group I like the idea of /chaseon and the tank on hunter mode, but I remained unsure what roles to give my tank for this. I am hunting some cyclops which are unmezzable and so the tank is frequently changing targets when I have adds. How do most people set the roles for tank, puller, hunter, MA, etc?

1. Check your in-game background fps setting. Many people set this to minimum thinking that it will help performance be reducing frames drawn. Unfortunately, what EQ actually does, is simply pauses the programming loop so it just makes the client laggy. Set it to unlimited and use the MQ Framelimiter instead.

2. Your tank should, indeed, be your MA. This is a divergence from how a group of 6 individual players might play. Your tank will not swap targets to hold agro on a multi mob pull, you will use AE threat gen tools to do that. Most automation tools assume that there is active crowd control such that the tank need not switch targets constantly.

 

[RGTorv]

Thanks for tips and words of encouragement. Persistence was indeed the key.

I changed the FPS settings in game, activated MQFramerate with the settings recommended by Sic, and disabled ISBoxer just to eliminate a variable. I deleted my RGMerc .inis and started over. I set my tank as main tank, main assist, and puller to avoid any conflicts. While most of this was helpful to some extent anyway, I still found my RGMerc controlled characters mostly wanted to sit inactive without ever joining the battle. My shaman would thankfully heal and canni. Over time I discovered two clues:

1. When an add joined the fight, everyone would get off their duffs and help out in my hour of need.
2. After various fits of rebooting, restarting EQ, MQ, and basically any Q you can think of, one of my characters started attacking. I looked at him and noticed that an EQ bug had occurred which wiped his Xtarget window settings. This seems to happen rarely and I keep my (somewhat complicated) xtarget setup in a saved set so I can quickly restore it when this happens. I really love the new-to-me xtarget feature of EQ, by the way.

After seeing both of those clues, I wiped the xtarget window from another character, and sure enough, he started to join me in combat. One by one I did this until my whole team engaged. Eventually I narrowed down the issue to the fact that I had one xtarget slot set to Main Assist's Target.

When a target appears in the Xtargets window as MA's Target, it does NOT appear in an autohater slot, which is usually good because it keeps the same mob from appearing in the window twice, which would be a bit confusing. But it appears that RGMercs (and probably KissAssist though I haven't tested that again yet to confirm it was the same problem) wants a hostile creature in an xtarget autohater slot for it to act on. When I was getting an add before I discovered this, then I had a hater who wasn't my MA's target, so it appeared in the autohater slot and everyone jumped into the fray. When I removed the MA's target slot from the window of each character, even a single hostile mob became an autohater, and thus my whole team would fight as normal. I didn't see any mention of this issue in the RGMercs manual or in searches of this forum.

My team is vastly more fun and effective with a higher participation rate. I still find some quirks (like my shaman preferring Canni I to Canni II), and my warrior struggles to hold aggro over my BL, and when there are adds I have to change targets frequently to keep aggro because at level 50 I have no AOE aggro abilities (as suggested above). But all in all these are small and very manageable problems that are greatly outweighed by the convenience and power of this macro. Thanks all for the help in figuring this out!