Question - CWTN Plugins VS KA or RGMercs (1 Viewer)

[naamloseeen]

Here's my 2 cents:

Would getting this help keep my groups alive?

I use the CWTN plugins and find them great. While they are well-tuned, they aren't really magic either. I think you'd have to look at the kind of damage that the group is taking. If it's just too much for the shaman to heal, upgrading to the plugin won't really help that. Having said that, in my experience, my groups don't die because the plugin didn't cast the right heal at the right time. They die because they are just underpowered or I don't have the right comp/strategy for the fight.

I also wanted to know if this purchase would help at all with movements on raids?

Probably not. The basic movement controls are the same as Kissassist with camp/manual/chase modes. You can set everyone to chase on a raid MA, which is useful, but that may or may not actually help you in your situation. I find the "vorpal" mode to be useful on raids for healers and such, but that's more about putting them in one spot vs. moving them to avoid mechanics, and it can still be emulated with KA.

I'm also worried that by purchasing the program I would be more easily detected by daybreak

I don't think this will make a difference either way.

As Chat mentioned above, you can always try them out on test. But, be aware, there's an EQ bug on test right now where melee disciplines are not showing up on Combat Abilities even if you've previously scribed them. You can still manually trigger them with /disc, but the CWTN plugins think that toons don't have the disciplines at all, so they don't try to use them. This significantly affects the performance of any melee toons running the plugins (I've had to go back to using KA on rogues and such).

 

[Teichou]

Access to all of the CWTN plugins is 10000% free on the test server and available for users specifically on the test server who either find the financial burden of live servers to exceed their investment to fun ratio, or for users to try.
You can in fact just use the plugins for free forever on the test server. As an alternative, if you're on the fence on if you should get the plugins, you're welcome to /testcopy your entire team, download RG test version of MQ, and load them all up or any combination of them for the purpose of testing them out to determine if they are the right fit for you.

I always forget about test lol

 

[Granditos]

I’m having a hard time going through the FAQs of really understanding the difference the CWTN plug-ins and a well written kissassist.ini (which I’m most familiar with).

 

[Wild Beagle]

I’m having a hard time going through the FAQs of really understanding the difference the CWTN plug-ins and a well written kissassist.ini (which I’m most familiar with).

Probably the biggest difference is the plugin has the ability to adapt on the fly where an INI requires dropping the old file loading a new file to change the behavior of the char.

 

[Oldman66]

I’m having a hard time going through the FAQs of really understanding the difference the CWTN plug-ins and a well written kissassist.ini (which I’m most familiar with).

CWTN plugins are plug n' play provided you have the spells. The automagic has been tested over and over to insure optimal efficiency. There's no guess work once you decide what options you would like to set. I use the plugins as well as KA and the plugins are hands down above all else. I am ASSuming you have viewed the videos but if not I highly recommend you do so. Grab a cocktail of your flavor and sit back and let the plugins do their magic.

 

[Hylander]

1. $20
2. about 3,500 more lines of combat logic
3. C++ compiled code > macroscript uncompiled code (faster, more is exposed)
4. don't have to update an INI file's (everytime you level or new expac is released) Spells, DPS, BUFFS, Heals, and Conditions sections,
5. works from level 1 to level whatever OOTB
6. configurable FrontEnd, and on-the-fly
7. someone else has done all the heavy logic lifting and coded it, not DIY

 

[Granditos]

1. $20
2. about 3,500 more lines of combat logic
3. C++ compiled code > macroscript uncompiled code (faster, more is exposed)
4. don't have to update an INI file's (everytime you level or new expac is released) Spells, DPS, BUFFS, Heals, and Conditions sections,
5. works from level 1 to level whatever OOTB
6. configurable FrontEnd, and on-the-fly
7. someone else has done all the heavy logic lifting and coded it, not DIY

Other than being easier, plug and play, and changes on the fly it will efficiently be same/similar to a well written ini until it has to be changed again?

 

[Granditos]

CWTN plugins are plug n' play provided you have the spells. The automagic has been tested over and over to insure optimal efficiency. There's no guess work once you decide what options you would like to set. I use the plugins as well as KA and the plugins are hands down above all else. I am ASSuming you have viewed the videos but if not I highly recommend you do so. Grab a cocktail of your flavor and sit back and let the plugins do their magic.

Are they hands down the best in most ease of use or do they easily out pace performance of a well written ini?

 

[Sic]

just /testcopy and try for yourself - they're included with VV lvl 2

everything else is just opinion and design choices from the people who made kiss vs the people who made cwtn plugins.

eq is a pretty simple game as far as game play goes - no automation can make a character do more damage/healing/whatever than it is capable of doing. There is nothing in this game that would require xyz automation over some other automation and plenty of folks have other homebrew-type stuff.

cwtn and i just want to take the "work" out of it, so you can focus on playing the game - doing the events/scripts of the game, without worrying about trying to have your toons do stuff.

also merged this into the existing long answered thread about the same topic. it is real important to look for existing discussions because you can and will end up with "re-explanation fatigue" - look at the long response that cwtn gave here

 

[Nedus]

Are they hands down the best in most ease of use or do they easily out pace performance of a well written ini?

i find they are both easier to use and out pace ini . i used to box classes that ctwn doesnt have but have switched to ones they do have just for the sheer inpact they have on my game play . they have well written faq and videos explaining everything you need to know.

 

[Granditos]

just /testcopy and try for yourself - they're included with VV lvl 2

everything else is just opinion and design choices from the people who made kiss vs the people who made cwtn plugins.

eq is a pretty simple game as far as game play goes - no automation can make a character do more damage/healing/whatever than it is capable of doing. There is nothing in this game that would require xyz automation over some other automation and plenty of folks have other homebrew-type stuff.

cwtn and i just want to take the "work" out of it, so you can focus on playing the game - doing the events/scripts of the game, without worrying about trying to have your toons do stuff.

also merged this into the existing long answered thread about the same topic. it is real important to look for existing discussions because you can and will end up with "re-explanation fatigue" - look at the long response that cwtn gave here

Thanks Sic. What do you mean test copy and try for yourself? At the CWTN plug-ins available for free on test?

 

[Sic]

Thanks Sic. What do you mean test copy and try for yourself? At the CWTN plug-ins available for free on test?

yes, where i said that, is where i said that =p

definitely recommend trying them out and see if they meet your wants/needs

 

[Granditos]

View attachment 46247
yes, where i said that, is where i said that =p

definitely recommend trying them out and see if they meet your wants/needs

Yeah but I have VV lvl 2. Did know there was any difference between features on test versus live for very Vanilla.

 

[Oldman66]

Yeah but I have VV lvl 2. Did know there was any difference between features on test versus live for very Vanilla.

Test Server allows you to try them out free. Live has a paid 1yr license per class to use them. The only well written INI that I have was written by Sic for bards. I have tried a few classes and they all fell short of the CWTN plugins. You might have the skills to make a well written one but I surely don't. I am a copy and paste guy

 

[Granditos]

Test Server allows you to try them out free. Live has a paid 1yr license per class to use them. The only well written INI that I have was written by Sic for bards. I have tried a few classes and they all fell short of the CWTN plugins. You might have the skills to make a well written one but I surely don't. I am a copy and paste guy

Ah perfect! Didn’t know about this. I’ll give them a shot!

 

[Hylander]

Other than being easier, plug and play, and changes on the fly it will efficiently be same/similar to a well written ini until it has to be changed again?

so yeah, any automation tool, whether it be, Kiss, CWTN, Xgen, RG Mercs, Mule will do the job of automating your team. How close you get to the theoretical maximum of the characters' and team's capability in any given situation is down to the config, the control, and the execution. All will yield similar results, but like teabags, you only find out how good they are when you put them in hot water.

 

[DankDD]

I hope this is the right place to post. I'm still just getting accustomed to using some of the generously posted Kiss scripts, but it sounds like these plugins are a nice shortcut to getting all the functionality you may want.

Are these plugins able to do things kissassist cannot? Are they simply really well made kissassist INI's?

If there's a behavior I want modified, am I SOL if that isn't an option designed into the plugin?

Thanks!

 

[RobRenfro]

The plugins are the closest thing you will ever have to an actual person overseeing your toon.
Because they are player made to be the best options available.

 

[TempusX]

By these plugins, i suppose you refer to the CWTN selection. They are pay to play, have extensive work in them and for lack of better terms, "They just work". They offer less in terms of configurability which allows them to maximize how they operate with relatively pre-defined actions/playstyles. In fairness, at higher levels, things like burns and heal rotations are pretty much one way without much need for variation. You can grab a CWTN of a class you've got zero knowledge how to play, and it'll play it for you as well as a guy thats been playin the class for years.


Kissassist is entirely driven by you, and free (if thats a concern to you). However you need to configure everything in kissassist. If you want specific buffs to fire on specific toons/class types, at certain times, you need to define that in the ini file. Much the same for your dps, mezzing, healing, and burn routines. It allows you more flexibility in how you want to react to things, but it takes more working knowledge of macroscript (to generate conditional statements if needed) and working knowledge of the class and how you want it to play. the Kissassist ini library has loads of good examples.

Other things like RGMercs (and Luamercs!) are similar to CWTN, although operate on a macro/Lua format (and free), but come with predefined setups. rgmercs Lua edition has the ability (I believe) to change spells in the Lua configs, but it still has a sort of format it follows.

 

[naamloseeen]

Since you didn't specify a plugin, I assume you're talking about the CWTN class plugins.

Are these plugins able to do things kissassist cannot?

No. At the end of the day, the plugins only have access to the same information that you'd have through any other automation.

Are they simply really well made kissassist INI's?

No, because they aren't using Kissassist to automate. There's a lot more code behind that tries to make smarter decisions about what your toon should do. You can accomplish this through other means, but it's nice that someone else has done all of the heavy lifting.

If there's a behavior I want modified, am I SOL if that isn't an option designed into the plugin?

Maybe. You do get a fair amount of flexibility to use certain spells that you like and most of the common things that you'd want to do with any class have toggles. However, there are certain things the plugins just won't do, so you're on your own for that. In the past, I've made extensive use of custom Lua scripts to pause the plugins and execute some weird stuff when needed. Things like running to an aura in a missions, casting a certain spell at a certain time, seppuku, etc. From single group content to raids, I haven't run into a situation that I couldn't automate between the plugins and some custom scripting where needed.

If you're asking why would someone choose to use a class plugin instead of Kiss, I prefer to use them because they "just work" for 90%+ of the content that I do. I recently came back after about a year-long hiatus and it's been super nice to get up and running with no fuss. I'm leveling a fresh set of toons on a new server and my Kiss bard configuration is always 5-10 levels behind because I can't be bothered to stop and update his ini every 30 minutes. It's also really good for classes that I don't know anything about. I don't have to spend a bunch of time figuring out which spell to cast every time a toon gets a new set of spells.

You can always copy your toons down to the test server to try out the CWTN plugins for free.

 

[Redfrog]

Both of those automations are great tools, but do have differences. Class plugins is the assumption.

-KissAssist (KA) has a lot more configurability and the more you learn to code in Conditionals and how to layout spells, you can really do a lot of specific things you may like/need. Mix that with many luas and you have so much options.
-Plugins are built really well, but are not made for the same level of configurability. They are made to work well at what they do, which is a 'most people/most case needs' type of thing. Not all Lua are good combinations with the plugins.

-KA is included with your membership and is a all classes tool.
-Plugins are an additional paid service as they are player made and maintained. Plugins are $20/year per class (almost all classes available). Very reasonable price for the well put together tools and highly updated by the creators, with wonderful forum assist.

-KA requires you to build/copy/modify the ini files and you will change them as you level, new gear/spells/discs all need your input. Tons of Ini files (Free) in the Library to start with and you modify at your hearts content.
- Plugins are load and go play. They also do all spells memorizing and fill your spell bar. thee is a BYOS(Bring Your Own Spells) ability and the plugins have a way to use what your spell bar is, very fast casting and active for downtime. Certain encounters you may find plugins need a bit of learning to change your play to see how the plugins will react, very easy to learn, I point it out to compare that KA, you can configure and even make 'temp ini files' to use for certain encounters.

-KA is a macro. Macros can only be run one macro at a time. Plugins can be loaded to run with 1 macro or many plugins (there are more than the paid ones) or many Lua scripts.
-Plugins run smooth and so fast and can work with a macro or Lua (many combat related scripts cause issues). So again, you easily will learn to slightly adapt your playstyle with the plugins. Worth it.

-KA has some addons that can help if you like certain things like a Gui type window, but is mostly text edited. Commands also can be typed as you go. Learning from ini building is actually really good skill.
- Plugins are paid on Live servers and all run free on Test server, so you can easily /copy a character on Test and try any out or if you are a Test Player, all available to you free.

Different toolsets but both incredible options. I do not see one as superior to the other. I do have plugins and use them happily. But I started (and still use KA) for somethings.

 

[Sic]

I hope this is the right place to post. I'm still just getting accustomed to using some of the generously posted Kiss scripts, but it sounds like these plugins are a nice shortcut to getting all the functionality you may want.

Are these plugins able to do things kissassist cannot? Are they simply really well made kissassist INI's?

If there's a behavior I want modified, am I SOL if that isn't an option designed into the plugin?

Thanks!

No it wasn't the right location, but I moved it for you (mewrged into one of the longer threads about it - and going to use this as the "merge to" thread for when it comes up in the future"

Some searching would have found other times this conversation has happened. Not doing so, you run into "already answered that with more words" fatigue and you get less involved answers. but since i merged it, go back and read some of the replies. keep in mind, as with anything on the internet it is a "snapshot" of when that post was made, and there may be differences or changes since then

There are a lot of great automations available these days - more than ever.

You should try them and see what works for you.

All the cwtn class plugins are included with your VV lvl 2 for the test server build, so you can even /test copy and use them on your actual toons.

If you check out the sticky there are a ton of videos and guides talking about how the plugins function, and about how each one does various things

Please see >>> Getting Started with CWTN plugins! (Movement, UI Window, Clickies, Pulling, ETC) Check Here First! <<<

 

[DankDD]

No it wasn't the right location, but I moved it for you (mewrged into one of the longer threads about it - and going to use this as the "merge to" thread for when it comes up in the future"

Some searching would have found other times this conversation has happened. Not doing so, you run into "already answered that with more words" fatigue and you get less involved answers. but since i merged it, go back and read some of the replies. keep in mind, as with anything on the internet it is a "snapshot" of when that post was made, and there may be differences or changes since then

There are a lot of great automations available these days - more than ever.

You should try them and see what works for you.

All the cwtn class plugins are included with your VV lvl 2 for the test server build, so you can even /test copy and use them on your actual toons.

If you check out the sticky there are a ton of videos and guides talking about how the plugins function, and about how each one does various things

Please see >>> Getting Started with CWTN plugins! (Movement, UI Window, Clickies, Pulling, ETC) Check Here First! <<<

Thank you. Lots of good information here.

 

[ChatWithThisName]

Are these plugins able to do things kissassist cannot? Are they simply really well made kissassist INI's?

If there's a behavior I want modified, am I SOL if that isn't an option designed into the plugin?

Thanks!

Things KA Cannot: Yes. Despite the answers provided by some, they do things KA cannot or does not.

For example, in KA if you level up and buy new spells in order to use them you now need to go and edit your INI to update it to use the new spells and remove the old spells. The plugins will automatically detect you've leveled up, let you know what spells you don't currently have that the plugin would like to use or can use and then if you go and buy and scribe said spells it will automatically detect that you've scribed a new spell and automatically update it's loadout to use the new spell automagically.

It automatically detects the need for reagents in spells and will let you know if it's missing the reagent for a spell it would like to use. Thus prompting you to go out and buy them so you can use the spell in question if you so choose.

You can block a buff in the game using EQ's buff blocking interface and other CWTN class plugin toons will no longer try to cast that spell on you.

When you set a camp the camp, the pullradius, pullarc, and pullrange (range of a pull ability) are shown on the map on layer 2.

If you're using MQ2BuffMe BuffMe gets a list of buffs from the class plugins and you can use "all" and it will use all the buffs that the class is known to have available to buff you/the intended buff target.

Our named detection isn't built into MQ making it so that you have nearly no false positives for named burns. If you do have a false positive simply reporting it to us will get it updated. We just use an internal list as opposed to trying to guess.

We have a UI, which KA doesn't have. We use an ImGui UI for users to interact with the options available to the class you're currently using, including an output window specifically for things the plugin is doing, a settings tab that allows you to change any setting on the plugin on the fly with the click of the mouse.

The plugins are always on, meaning you don't have to tell it to start before conducting combat, you simply change from one mode to the other for different behavior. Such as manual mode to manually move around, or chase mode to follow a main assist designated in the group window.

The rogue plugin will automatically go and retrieve a fallen group member and return them to your camp if you have a camp set, allowing the characters will the ability to resurrect to bring them back into the fight.

We won't break invis while you're traveling to heal/buff a character. Allowing you to not pause the plugins while traveling if you choose not to.

I'm sure there is a lot more things that different or that the plugins do that KA doesn't or cannot do. But I'd probably be beating a dead horse at this point.

Regarding being limited to things built into the plugins, yes it would be accurate to say that unless the option is available to you in the plugin you're more or less SoL, but if it's reasonable to add a feature to a plugin then we will. But you'll have to articulate a reason for it as we're not just going to add a toggle for everything the character can do. We're generally speaking providing support at all hours, less in the middle of the night (US time), and we have fairly robust documentation/videos that will get you through 99.99% of situations.

If you want to try the plugins without committing to a purchase, or you just happen to be playing on the test server, then you can use them on the test server for free and try all the class plugins that are currently available (Bard is still in development) at the same time without paying for anything additional beyond your level 2 redguides sub.

I hope this information will prove useful to you in making your decision on which you would like to try/use.

CWTN

 

[Froglok32]

so ive got a box group i tried out with the CWTN Plugins and dang those babies are sweet! had a sk ench ranger beast necro cleric group, but ive come back over to live, and i saw u had to buy the CWTN plugins, im prolly gonna have to get around to that, cause that is real nice, open and go. but ive read the Kissassist thing, off topic here, but how do u add a monster that cant be mezzed to ur ignore to mez stuff? i saw it saying something about i can do that? but i also wanted to say, it seems the CWTN reacts faster, than the Kissassist. its more responsive, is it just the difference? ive been seeing Mule Assist and RG mercs too, was gonna look at those soon.

 

[Lisie]

KissAssist - Read📖Guides

www.redguides.com

KA/MA tend to be a bit more configurable to handle things specifically how you want to, with the spells you want.

CWTN/RGMercs tend to be more self contained and just "work"

The downside to the configurability of KA/MA is that you have to set up the configuration, updating it as you gain new items and spells.

CWTN/RGMercs just work out of the box, without requiring a great deal of configuration. But as such, they are less customizable.

 

[Froglok32]

sorry ive looked at that ten times and just missed it, sorry bout that

 

[cintile]

Honestly, If you liked the CWTN, but don't want to pay for that, you should just use Lua RGmercs. (Not to be confused with RGmercs).

The Lua version is much better. It has a user interface, its customizable and works great. You could do your whole group on Lua Rgmercs and do just fine.

Combat Assist - RGMercs - Lua Edition!

For those not following along - all classes have been tested running from 1-25 and most classes have been tested in End-Game Raid content. All classes are working (even Bards!) Many people have worked on this to Thank You to everyone who helped...

www.redguides.com

 

[arcreactorkc]

I have started using Rgmercs Lua instead of KA and so far am loving it.

I have dabbled with the CWTN plugins but have had trouble running my box group using them. Perhaps I am not familiar enough with the plugins operation though.

 

[ChatWithThisName]

so ive got a box group i tried out with the CWTN Plugins and dang those babies are sweet! had a sk ench ranger beast necro cleric group, but ive come back over to live, and i saw u had to buy the CWTN plugins, im prolly gonna have to get around to that, cause that is real nice, open and go. but ive read the Kissassist thing, off topic here, but how do u add a monster that cant be mezzed to ur ignore to mez stuff? i saw it saying something about i can do that? but i also wanted to say, it seems the CWTN reacts faster, than the Kissassist. its more responsive, is it just the difference? ive been seeing Mule Assist and RG mercs too, was gonna look at those soon.

Re: and i saw u had to buy the CWTN plugins, prolly gonna have to get around that -- EQ is free on test (gold) and so are the plugins. This is specifically for people who want to use them but cannot afford them, don't want to spend money on them, or for people to just try them before they purchase them. This is the way around that.
As others have mentioned, the closest thing to the plugins is going to be RGMercs (in whatever form).
KA can be useful, but it's dependent on you and how you've set it up. It is less responsive.
I too second the notion that RGMercs will probably be closer to what you're after than KA.

I have started using Rgmercs LUA instead of KA and so far am loving it.

I have dabbled with the CWTN plugins but have had trouble running my box group using them. Perhaps I am not familiar enough with the plugins operation though.

As with all tools understanding the fundamentals of using the plugins is important. There are a lot of features these days and it takes a bit to learn to use something different.
But it's also important to understand asking for assistance when having troubles with the plugins and getting typically quick replies is part of the package. If you're having issues with them there is generally FAQ, videos guides, and of course requests for help that can be used to help overcome those troubles.

 

[Froglok32]

Re: and i saw u had to buy the CWTN plugins, prolly gonna have to get around that -- EQ is free on test (gold) and so are the plugins. This is specifically for people who want to use them but cannot afford them, don't want to spend money on them, or for people to just try them before they purchase them. This is the way around that.
As others have mentioned, the closest thing to the plugins is going to be RGMercs (in whatever form).
KA can be useful, but it's dependent on you and how you've set it up. It is less responsive.
I too second the notion that RGMercs will probably be closer to what you're after than KA.


As with all tools understanding the fundamentals of using the plugins is important. There are a lot of features these days and it takes a bit to learn to use something different.
But it's also important to understand asking for assistance when having troubles with the plugins and getting typically quick replies is part of the package. If you're having issues with them there is generally FAQ, videos guides, and of course requests for help that can be used to help overcome those troubles.

ahh yeah hehe yeah ive been on test with them, and i went over to live to start building something and saw, hey with how much work u put in those they are FOR SURE worth it man it was awsome! i really really appreciate those EQ has been a blast over on Test with these, and setting up Hotkeys from Sics Hotkey Guide. i just noticed KA was firing more slowly than how smooth ur Plugins were on the ball with stuff. only thing i was trying to figure out, was if something added and was a good distance away and was beating on say my cleric, to get the sk to go over there, the way ive been dealing with it is, /Shd Mode 0 running over grabbing it, and /shd mode 4 , then resetting my puller spot just right to pull the mobs i wanted hehe i saw there was something like that in the Also Kissassist

 

[ChatWithThisName]

ahh yeah hehe yeah ive been on test with them, and i went over to live to start building something and saw, hey with how much work u put in those they are FOR SURE worth it man it was awsome! i really really appreciate those EQ has been a blast over on Test with these, and setting up Hotkeys from Sics Hotkey Guide. i just noticed KA was firing more slowly than how smooth ur Plugins were on the ball with stuff. only thing i was trying to figure out, was if something added and was a good distance away and was beating on say my cleric, to get the sk to go over there, the way ive been dealing with it is, /Shd Mode 0 running over grabbing it, and /shd mode 4 , then resetting my puller spot just right to pull the mobs i wanted hehe i saw there was something like that in the Also Kissassist

View attachment 61024

Sounds like the cleric wasn't inside the camp radius of the SK. If it was, the sk would auto help (assuming it wasn't already engaged with something). In which case you are not target locked in cwtn plugins. So you could just click a different target.

 

[MacQ]

I have been part of the MQ volunteer community for over 20 years, and I was one who stood vehemently against the idea of "paid sites" or "pay to play MQ solutions". I felt … the MQ community was started by and kept alive by volunteers who did the work for love of the game and/or for the satisfaction of creating code. That is still true because those core folks who keep MQ alive, not me since I don't have the skills, remain volunteers. No, I am not looking at everything through rose colored glasses like some old dude who sits around saying, “back in the good ol days …”; I am certainly aware of the shadier side of some folks who have used/benefited from MQ.

Anway, I created my own suite of macros that has served me well for decades, but I admit that some of the work I have seen in RG, like the CWTN plugins with support from Sic, is impressive. Sure, much work (macros, Lua scripts, plugins) remain free, I’ve published free work myself, but other work that comes with a nominal fee does provide additional options to the free work.

So, to those developers who voluntarily contribute content, go for it, and to those who ask a nominal fee for their hard work, go for it. Both groups provide value to the community, and nobody has a gun to their head to select pay to play products/solutions.

 

[Jetanroth]

I have been part of the MQ volunteer community for over 20 years, and I was one who stood vehemently against the idea of "paid sites" or "pay to play MQ solutions". I felt … the MQ community was started by and kept alive by volunteers who did the work for love of the game and/or for the satisfaction of creating code. That is still true because those core folks who keep MQ alive, not me since I don't have the skills, remain volunteers. No, I am not looking at everything through rose colored glasses like some old dude who sits around saying, “back in the good ol days …”; I am certainly aware of the shadier side of some folks who have used/benefited from MQ.

Anway, I created my own suite of macros that has served me well for decades, but I admit that some of the work I have seen in RG, like the CWTN plugins with support from Sic, is impressive. Sure, much work (macros, Lua scripts, plugins) remain free, I’ve published free work myself, but other work that comes with a nominal fee does provide additional options to the free work.

So, to those developers who voluntarily contribute content, go for it, and to those who ask a nominal fee for their hard work, go for it. Both groups provide value to the community, and nobody has a gun to their head to select pay to play products/solutions.

I can't say I understand this thinking at all.

Having a paid MQ site like RG is the entire reason the content here is so good and well maintained. Alot of people do volunteer MQ expertise and that is great but having a centralized place like RG to put it all together and create a community like this costs money and time.

I am MORE than happy to give my money to support the time and hard work that goes into keeping this community alive and well.

 

[MacQ]

I can't say I understand this thinking at all.

Having a paid MQ site like RG is the entire reason the content here is so good and well maintained. Alot of people do volunteer MQ expertise and that is great but having a centralized place like RG to put it all together and create a community like this costs money and time.

I am MORE than happy to give my money to support the time and hard work that goes into keeping this community alive and well.

I thought my message was clear. Years ago, I was (key word here is "was") not a fan of pay to play, but I have changed after seeing all the benefits of RG and the extensive content, including the content that includes a nominal fee.

 

[Jetanroth]

Hello Frens,

I am wondering about MQ2Berzerker, MQ2Cleric and so on. I am currently using KA11 with a bard, warrior, cleric, mage, berzerker. So I have watched Sic's videos on the matter and I was thinking about getting them. However, they are paid premium plugins and to get warrior, cleric and berzerker is about the same as all my eq accounts each month. So to the question.... Why buy these premium plugins ? Are they better then KA11 ? I am leaning towards getting them I just dont want to buy them and wind up not using them because the differences between the two and not significant enough. Any thoughts would be appreciated as they may aleive my indecision.

I have used KA and CWTN Plugins both extensively. I still use KA on my Bard (because CWTN his slacking on MQ2Bard!!! lol)

I can say definitively, you can make KA do just about anything you can do with the CWTN plugins...........at 10x more work.

Where CWTN plugins blow away all the competition is the fact that not only do they work EXTREMELY will right out of the box, zero configuration needed. They also KEEP themselves updated. Anytime any new spells or abilities come in, you dont edit an INI file or do any manual updates.

Also, the "on the fly" setting changes you can do with CWTN are super easy and very effective.

Bottom line. IF you can afford it the cost, there is no better choice than CWTN plugins. However, if money is a limiting factor go with KA or RGMerc (Lua is awesome) and you can do all the same things but with more work and tweaking needed.

 

[Endersword]

Just wondering high level, I've been running 6 characters, have them each set up with a class specific thing and that's basically all I've been running.

Seems to work fine for most things, but I'm doing a lot of stuff i guess manually and it sounds like there's more automated things, event-specific things or a more integrated way to be running stuff.

I guess just looking for a high level idea of what other people are running, RGMercs vs these individual ones, or do you run both, and what other important things are people running like Luas and stuff.

I've found basic like group missions I'm killing no problem, but it sounds like there's special things to tell your stuff to deal with ads or accomplish certain achievements or something? Is that the case?

And I'm sure I'm missing out on a lot of navigation or loot and just QoL stuff

 

[kaen01]

The cwtn class plugins runs your class in a combat situation, assisting, doing murder things and so on.

RGMercs also runs your classes in combat situations, assisting, doing murder things, i also believe rgmercs can do a few other things

Its all about how you want to control it, some like rgmercs, other likes cwtn plugins

You DO NOT run multiple combat bots at the same time, or you will have a bad time.

Run class plugins, or run rgmercs, or run kissassist, or run modbot, but never at the same on the same toon.

you can however have 1 toon run rgmercs, another toon run kissassist, and the rest of the team run class plugins if that makes you happy

 

[Endersword]

The cwtn class plugins runs your class in a combat situation, assisting, doing murder things and so on.

RGMercs also runs your classes in combat situations, assisting, doing murder things, i also believe rgmercs can do a few other things

Its all about how you want to control it, some like rgmercs, other likes cwtn plugins

You DO NOT run multiple combat bots at the same time, or you will have a bad time.

Run class plugins, or run rgmercs, or run kissassist, or run modbot, but never at the same on the same toon.

you can however have 1 toon run rgmercs, another toon run kissassist, and the rest of the team run class plugins if that makes you happy

Is there kind of a pros and cons to the two options?

 

[Redfrog]

Is there kind of a pros and cons to the two options?

Kaen nails it:

Its all about how you want to control it,

While there are more automations, the main 3 I use in mixed order:

1. CWTN class plugins: Paid Premium, I buy what I can as I can, that said, these work extremely well, but are set for fast and many abilities to happen and work really well together. You must adapt to their functions, not hard, but its strengths has limits in options. If you learn, super easy to do, how to maneuver your team, you will love these.
2. RGMercs Lua has a ton of features and works well with ALL classes, is included with your level 2 and has a lot more customization for your playstyle. Its strengths comes with a higher learning curve to many cool options. Its really awesome.
3. KissAssist is a macro, much older and not a Lua or plugin like those above and comes included with your Level 2. Its customization ability is above and beyond the king of automation for your choices of how you want things to happen. Seriously amazing compared to the newer automations above. Its strengths are amazing options, but its learning curve is larger to modify the ini settings and manual changes when you get new items/spells/abilities.

All 3 (and others on the site) are incredible and well developed and constantly updated. What works best is how you enjoy to play. The plugins are also free to try on the Test Server if that helps you.