Question - New Group (1 Viewer)

[jfrazi]

So I am going to make a new pet themed group and let the pets tank for me. Right now I am looking mag / mag / mag / clr / ench / ?

An immediate option of course is necro - snares, another pet, FD, back up rez etc. But I was also worried I may miss SOW or run speed early on in life, especially while pulling on a squishy. I know there is the newbie area totem, but does that off-set the needed speed for pulling without getting smacked? Looking for some knowledge from some other pet teamsters out there.

Additional potentially needed info: 2 mags set up as tank / 1 set up pure DPS - was going to start out KA as I like to tinker with the lines, but CWTN is a solid option and may handle the group better than I can myself. Thoughts from the pros?

 

[Doc James]

CWTN plugins for the supported classes. RGMercs for the rest (if you don't want to fiddle with INI's on Kiss).

Your setup will work. But it will take some time / levels to even out. First level ranges go by fast. I don't think you will miss SoW / Run speed mods

 

[Oldman66]

So I am going to make a new pet themed group and let the pets tank for me. Right now I am looking mag / mag / mag / clr / ench / ?

BST....got your pet and sow covered

 

[knave23]

+1 to BST and I would also swap a SHM in for CLR as well so you can have more pets and lion procs on all your pets.

I've been considering building a pet group in my raid setup and wondering how it would fare. My thinking was MAG/MAG/BST/SHM/BRD and wasn't sure if last slot should be ENC or another pet class.

 

[Jarlentor]

+1 to BST and I would also swap a SHM in for CLR as well so you can have more pets and lion procs on all your pets.

I've been considering building a pet group in my raid setup and wondering how it would fare. My thinking was MAG/MAG/BST/SHM/BRD and wasn't sure if last slot should be ENC or another pet class.

Personally, I'd say if you are gonna do this and add an enchanter, then drop the brd for necro.....more pets, and better CC. plus chanter IOG makes for mob melt

 

[RobRenfro]

You might want to do Mage Necro, Necro Enchanter Shaman Mage With the Plugins the Shaman puts out serious dps and heals and the necro does more damage than the mage in most cases.

 

[knave23]

Personally, I'd say if you are gonna do this and add an enchanter, then drop the brd for necro.....more pets, and better CC. plus chanter IOG makes for mob melt

Am I overestimating what bards bring to caster groups?

 

[Koko]

How can you forget about sk as a pet class?! don’t underestimate the power of ,”goner”!

 

[Redfrog]

Mag - Mag - Bst - Nec - Shm -Enc
1 Tank Mag
1 DPS Mag
Bst pet tanks good (will have good buffs in this group)
Nec DPS and rezzer (and pets galore with AA)
Shm pets, buffs galore (will be awhile to help rez, level 100 I think? but worth it)
Enc CC and buffs

 

[InvisigothMT]

I seems to me that there are assumptions being made about what a pet group is. What it isn't is a Tank-> aDPS->more aDPS --> ??? _healer maybe.

Pet groups were some of my most fond memories in the early game where all the people I was grouped with had pets which were sicced on mobs as fast as they could be pulled.

The main thing is get a collection of pet classes and tear it up.

Anyway, depending on whether or not you can deal with multiple charm pets you can have a wide range of classes in a group. For fun you might go MAG/BST/ENC/BRD/DRU/SK and even if you don't have an animal charmed by the DRU they can still send swarm pets. Bards in fact have multiple swarm pet which is fun to constantly keep on cooldown when in a guild groups

 

[jfrazi]

so I finally settled on mag / mag / bst / necro / clr / ench

Oddly enough I had un-used versions of all of these across my old accounts lol , so the group started at lvl 70 ROFL.

 

[Jarlentor]

so I finally settled on mag / mag / bst / necro / clr / ench

Oddly enough I had un-used versions of all of these across my old accounts lol , so the group started at lvl 70 ROFL.

hahaha... yeah... seems the way these days..... when I start going through older accounts I find that everything I plan to make is already there from a previous excursion or experiment! :P

hope ya enjoy!

 

[reefrash]

Mag - Mag - Bst - Nec - Shm -Enc
1 Tank Mag
1 DPS Mag
Bst pet tanks good (will have good buffs in this group)
Nec DPS and rezzer (and pets galore with AA)
Shm pets, buffs galore (will be awhile to help rez, level 100 I think? but worth it)
Enc CC and buffs

thats how id go for all pet group also. solid killer group. Pettankhunter or Pettankpuller in kissassist on the mage tank and youll be golden.

ive a druid in my mix tho, but i do keep his level 50ish pet up so he feels part of the pet group. ive it set to charge when mob is at 3% hoping it may get a kill =)

 

[jfrazi]

level 50ish pet up so he feels part of the pet group. ive it set to charge when mob is at 3% hoping it may get a kill =)

 

[jfrazi]

So I did all the "basic" set up stuff for the crew - created a group - fellowship - set up autogroup and roles etc. I still need to fill in some spells - none of these guys were on a starting line-up, so spell holes all over and they are all FTP accounts.

Next query for you pro Pet group runners - does CWTN plugins TANK mode work as well as KA PETTANK mode? I have most of the CWTN plugs and I set up the Bst to be my tank out of the gate, but it seems like he is competing with this pet for agro rather than letting the pet do the work? Or maybe there is just a setting I need to dial in. Or maybe I need to let one of mages do it. We did a little light work, did have a wipe but that was my fault. Part of wanting to do this crew is so I can keep them all FTP and still get some stuff done.

Thoughts?

 

[reefrash]

Hey, thats him!

 

[reefrash]

So I did all the "basic" set up stuff for the crew - created a group - fellowship - set up autogroup and roles etc. I still need to fill in some spells - none of these guys were on a starting line-up, so spell holes all over and they are all FTP accounts.

Next query for you pro Pet group runners - does CWTN plugins TANK mode work as well as KA PETTANK mode? I have most of the CWTN plugs and I set up the Bst to be my tank out of the gate, but it seems like he is competing with this pet for agro rather than letting the pet do the work? Or maybe there is just a setting I need to dial in. Or maybe I need to let one of mages do it. We did a little light work, did have a wipe but that was my fault. Part of wanting to do this crew is so I can keep them all FTP and still get some stuff done.

Thoughts?

Using the mage as CWTN puller tank is squirlly compared with the KA pet pull when pulling packs of mobs. When pulling a pack with malo instead of pet, the mage gets whacked by adds. Sometimes hard enough for the sham or druid to emergency heal, grab agro and die itself. In my case the other healer gets him back up, and by then the enchanter has mezes so things move smoothly. No issues at all with singles or even double pulls, its the 3+ where things get dicey

KA can also do full pet toys handout which is nice to have also. I tend to run as many of the CWTN as i can on my toons just for sameness and otherwise top notch performance anyway though.

 

[Naeeldar]

Am I overestimating what bards bring to caster groups?

No, you had it right. Your group with bard will do far more dps than with an ench in group.

 

[jfrazi]

but I dun have an extra bard laying around

Bst pet tanks good (will have good buffs in this group)

When you set up your bst to tank - to you still let him melee, or do you set him up more as a caster? I am rolling with my bst as the tank currently (he had a minion earring already) - right now I am letting him mix it up in melee a bit, but I can see where on tougher fights he may take a beating.

 

[Sic]

but I dun have an extra bard laying around


When you set up your bst to tank - to you still let him melee, or do you set him up more as a caster? I am rolling with my bst as the tank currently (he had a minion earring already) - right now I am letting him mix it up in melee a bit, but I can see where on tougher fights he may take a beating.

your beast tanking, should make sure you're using the tanking pet buff, and using pet taunt etc

 

[jfrazi]

your beast tanking, should make sure you're using the tanking pet buff, and using pet taunt etc

I updated his spells todays so he has all of his goodies - his gear is still trash, but baby steps. With him taking the tanking role I am expecting just like any other group that he will be the gear hungriest toon. At bare minimum I need to keep the minion earring as high as I can all the time.

For science one night I may try to do a side by side between him and a mage and see which one handles the load better since outside buffs will be the same etc.

 

[jfrazi]

Science:
both toons are lvl 80 and using the same level range pet
I used the mage summoned threat blades on both
I was able to set the mage to no melee - so she stayed at a safe distance (unable to do so with Bst)
Bst has a minion earring currently / mage does not
Both toons are using CWTN plugs

Results: Tank mode
for straight up singular agro tanking - the mage pet won out and held agro better on its own (no target switching)
the Bst would hold agro between him and his pet - but it would go back and forth and he would need healing as well
the cleric work load was still similar between the two and she never had any issues keeping our "tank" standing

Results: Puller Tank mode
the bst was far away the best choice here - he takes hits better with heavier armor and never splatted on a pull
the mage did splat on a couple of pulls getting caught out

Results: tankie utility
the bst gets an edge here because he was able to delve into the bst tool kit and use single target paragon on himself
the bst also has the stronger all around heal kit as he can mend his pet and himself or team mates - though obviously no where near what the cleric was doing

Final thoughts:
I honestly believe that either one makes a good pet group tank. the mage gets the edge if you have a strong designated puller / the bst gets the edge if he is puller tanking.

** full disclosure - whiskey may or may not have been involved / I am not a scientist and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night **

 

[Hipchecktwostep]

At 86 beast pets get a tank https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=27111 stance as well as a DPS Stance. Not sure if that applies to mage pets as well.

 

[jfrazi]

At 86 beast pets get a tank https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=27111 stance as well as a DPS Stance. Not sure if that applies to mage pets as well.

 

[reefrash]

Science:
both toons are lvl 80 and using the same level range pet
I used the mage summoned threat blades on both
I was able to set the mage to no melee - so she stayed at a safe distance (unable to do so with Bst)
Bst has a minion earring currently / mage does not
Both toons are using CWTN plugs

Results: Tank mode
for straight up singular agro tanking - the mage pet won out and held agro better on its own (no target switching)
the Bst would hold agro between him and his pet - but it would go back and forth and he would need healing as well
the cleric work load was still similar between the two and she never had any issues keeping our "tank" standing

Results: Puller Tank mode
the bst was far away the best choice here - he takes hits better with heavier armor and never splatted on a pull
the mage did splat on a couple of pulls getting caught out

Results: tankie utility
the bst gets an edge here because he was able to delve into the bst tool kit and use single target paragon on himself
the bst also has the stronger all around heal kit as he can mend his pet and himself or team mates - though obviously no where near what the cleric was doing

Final thoughts:
I honestly believe that either one makes a good pet group tank. the mage gets the edge if you have a strong designated puller / the bst gets the edge if he is puller tanking.

** full disclosure - whiskey may or may not have been involved / I am not a scientist and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night **

Thanks for the update!
The KA pet tank puller makes a huge difference in beatings i imagine for both the mage and beast.
The mage self buff bodyguard usually picks up the adds when pulling a pack with malo but can get hairy with a large pull.

At 86 beast pets get a tank https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=27111 stance as well as a DPS Stance. Not sure if that applies to mage pets as well.

Mages pull out different pets depending. Water and air pets seem to be tankable enough (with good dps) to skip the earth tank pet. Combined with the pet shield spells, they can really take a beating. Better than my paladin by far. The lack of AoE taunt along with the fast squish is the gimpage tho.

 

[jfrazi]

Those are good points - I think like most classes there is still more spell development to go that will affect the outcome of my "research" - these guys are only 82 now. Going a slower route to earn some capital for spells / gear upgrades.

The differing mage pet is also a good point. Right now I am just testing using highest level - so water is what we got. But I imagine the air pet would be a good choice as well since it can stun etc. may not be as much DPS, but would limit it's own dmg intake via stuns potentially.

will have to do some more science down the road!

 

[Peppe]

How does a group with pets collect all aggro like a tank? I mean, if you gonna do missions like the one Fight Fire in TBL? That one will be one tough cookie to beat with only pets and not able to agg whole groups at once.

 

[jfrazi]

TBH - I am not too concerned with doing missions with this team. Knowing that I will not have a serious brick wall tank up front with a superior tool box, I was going into this group as something new, but also as a team that can farm it's happy lil arse clean off with very little investment. It is seriously fun to watch a mob just get swarmed under by the amount of pets this team generates.

Not about content on this one - just fun and something new to me

 

[Peppe]

TBH - I am not too concerned with doing missions with this team. Knowing that I will not have a serious brick wall tank up front with a superior tool box, I was going into this group as something new, but also as a team that can farm it's happy lil arse clean off with very little investment. It is seriously fun to watch a mob just get swarmed under by the amount of pets this team generates.

Not about content on this one - just fun and something new to me

I see, as I thought =)

I got a team of 4 nec 1 clc and a bard, its fun to just farm stuff and see the pets in action, hehe. (I also got a full group of nec, team of 6, ready for some raid if I ever find a guild who need em)

 

[reefrash]

How does a group with pets collect all aggro like a tank? I mean, if you gonna do missions like the one Fight Fire in TBL? That one will be one tough cookie to beat with only pets and not able to agg whole groups at once.

Thats tough for sure. id 'cheat' the rules some and call an SK a pet class and all issues solved =)

The enchanter really is going to pull his weight no matter the senerio thats for sure.