I am using KA and the cobbled Lua in this thread, I just let them run all over and make sure I get the tank to the spider and shalo.
-
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Guide - Heroes Are Forged - Laurion Song - Sic vid
- Thread starter Sic
- Start date
I use chase mode for my team almost 24/7
It seems as though Shalowain has an AE that hits within about 5 secs of her going active, and then the notes get called and appear to come directly from her and path to the toons called. I might be mistaken but it's hard to tell as I attribute the delay/inconsistency to bug/lag issues.
you got this! good luck
That's the ticket!!! Never say quit because it feels great when you win!
It definitely frustrated me to get it down and I still lose a toon or two now and again as it moves rather fast after the lich dies and I find it easier/harder depending on where the lich dies and I am forced to start kiting Shalowain around. I'm sure someone has it mastered better than I as I tend to be my own worst enemy tho =)
I never understood how they can balance content for people who can literally do the event as is in 56 seconds and also balance it for groups like mine. Tough job - So who knows the approach they will take.
The dps varies alot on the forums. This should give you an idea of near minimal dps to kill slime without the aura - The aura is starting to form "you feel it getting warm" and see aura on ground. It doesnt explode if you kill the slime soon after. With less dps than this, you're going to get a big aoe.
Few replies for earlier/other threads - oh you get 125, youll do X amount of dps etc. Take all that with a grain of salt. This is a non "optimal" group. NO sk, no bard, no shaman - Look at most everyone elses group make up and its those 3 trinity +whatever. These toons listed are 125, nearing max aa(mage is way off, but i think i got the best focus covered),t3 weapons, all t3 visible, largely t3 non vis, 75% newest type 5 augs, gold accounts. rk2 spells/tomes.
What don't they have? Outside of ideal group makeup for dps.... Heroic AA are low
This is the rogue, so there is room for more +atk here. They don't have Challenger completed augs, so no proc augs. They don't have all new t3 augs, until I finish t3 non vis. Group item clickies for current expansion, no old raid 17% over haste etc. Not sure how folks with true group gear are doing 2-3x this dps Except the shaman/bard/sk combo. Seems silly that group makeup should scale dps that much.I'm chugging away on upgrades and i'll get this mission done eventually. Killed the lich twice but not sure how to setup my toons to take advantage of the LEM. I'm dead almost as soon as I engage final boss. So its hard to even see whats going on. Maybe its time I record some runs.
Just posting this for folks on the lower side of dps to give you some numbers to compare to. With this group/dps I do slime without burning, barely complete it. Struggle with eggs, but its not a biggy tank is more than enough to deal with boss+add. Only down side to not breaking eggs is no achievement and longer mission time. Burn the lich. This has been a struggle but its mostly been lack of control/automation settings. The casters were chasing too much. Need to get them to hold still in the middle and keep nuking as the lich teleports around like a mad man.
Good luck - and thanks for all the info.
Welcome any tips, especially priority for increasing dps on the team as a whole.
Oldtimer I certainly know what you're talking about. My best dps team is sk/shm/brd/rog/rog/bst and I don't hit 4m dps non-burn on the slime. This for a 125/(mostly)max aa group. Maybe we need a dedicated 'how to fix my dps' thread?
As you have stated you need around 3.5m to not get ae'd by the slime, which happens at 60 secs.
For spider eggs, sk/shm/bst pets are enough to kill. Mag pet is even better. Be sure you're close to where the egg is, there could be one or more pet not engaging. I spent several runs working out the hotkeys to keep my team in check. I just ignore it now. If someone keeps trying to path to the egg, no harm done. I pet back off once the spider has been aggro'd. I don't want the thing to fail while the spider is sitting somewhere instead of coming to me.
The lich is stressful without a big boom dps group. 5 seconds isn't much time to move to him and do enough dps. You're double punished for not being a big dps team. With enough dps, you never even get to the 5 sec jump time. The worse your dps, the worse this gets. Use the hotkeys, but stop and kill the mummy unless Lich is close to dead. Having one lich up hasn't been all that detrimental to me so far, and getting dps on Shalo is way more important.
Watching Sic's vid, you'll notice the lem only runs characters away for a few seconds. Don't count on it keeping them out of the aura, it just gives you a few seconds to start kiting Shalowain. That was the thing for me, the kiting. I've tried every Lua or lem posted and for whatever reason every one failed in some way. My guess is the best thing for me would just have every character run away except my sk for like 5 secs on Shalo activation. Then kite from there. I'm still not sure what's optimal here for me, but since I've got the achievement it's whatever.
My guess for what they change is (hopefully) give a few more seconds on each Lich jump. I'm also betting that the 'free' achievement that we get for not knowing the mechanics of the optional clicks will be changing. Imaging coming into this cold. You spend days working out the click, handoff, etc routine and what do you find? The only way to fail that achievement. If you know and do nothing about it, you get the achievement. Not that I want this fixed, but who thought this up?
As you have stated you need around 3.5m to not get ae'd by the slime, which happens at 60 secs.
For spider eggs, sk/shm/bst pets are enough to kill. Mag pet is even better. Be sure you're close to where the egg is, there could be one or more pet not engaging. I spent several runs working out the hotkeys to keep my team in check. I just ignore it now. If someone keeps trying to path to the egg, no harm done. I pet back off once the spider has been aggro'd. I don't want the thing to fail while the spider is sitting somewhere instead of coming to me.
The lich is stressful without a big boom dps group. 5 seconds isn't much time to move to him and do enough dps. You're double punished for not being a big dps team. With enough dps, you never even get to the 5 sec jump time. The worse your dps, the worse this gets. Use the hotkeys, but stop and kill the mummy unless Lich is close to dead. Having one lich up hasn't been all that detrimental to me so far, and getting dps on Shalo is way more important.
Watching Sic's vid, you'll notice the lem only runs characters away for a few seconds. Don't count on it keeping them out of the aura, it just gives you a few seconds to start kiting Shalowain. That was the thing for me, the kiting. I've tried every Lua or lem posted and for whatever reason every one failed in some way. My guess is the best thing for me would just have every character run away except my sk for like 5 secs on Shalo activation. Then kite from there. I'm still not sure what's optimal here for me, but since I've got the achievement it's whatever.
My guess for what they change is (hopefully) give a few more seconds on each Lich jump. I'm also betting that the 'free' achievement that we get for not knowing the mechanics of the optional clicks will be changing. Imaging coming into this cold. You spend days working out the click, handoff, etc routine and what do you find? The only way to fail that achievement. If you know and do nothing about it, you get the achievement. Not that I want this fixed, but who thought this up?
Thanks for the Lua!! I finally got a win out of it, but im having a few issues still that is preventing consistency.
The bard for some reason (using KA) just stands and stops chasing the tank or attacking. Using Sics 125 bard ini.
When the spider warps and its time to kill the eggs, no matter what my tank will chase towards the eggs trying to attack. This will be the same for the rest of the group. This often results in terrain issues with some toons getting stuck due to levitate.
I don't use lev, and I just make sure the tank is near the spider always..
I will either have other toons nav id to me, or I will move them manually. When the healer gets the aura they usually like to heal themselves instead of run back so I run them back manually..
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couple things, dont be shrunk (grow if possible), and in your nav settings, you can set ledge size, weighted value to what you will cross.
Long story short, most likely he has tweaked his slightly to work with his group and ledges/water/doors.
To follow across the water I use the "Follow me" button. I know some users are using custom nav mesh to prevent the "Running around". Custom nav of the zone could help me greatly on lich as well but I just use intensify and some glyphs to burn it down before any mummy spawns.
Youll want to check out the lem page on usage. I keep the lem running full time
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Thanks to your Lua I was able to accomplish this mission today!
I modified it extensively and some of my mods didn't work well. So after I tune my version some more I'll post it here.
Giving @jb321 all the credit though, this is my first major foray into Lua re-coding and it took me 2 days before I was even ready for my first test run! The first run failed miserably so it was another 2 days of modifications before I tried and won!
Thank you!
Have I said I hate this mission.
1st off this takes for F'n forever...dumb -1
2nd I play gnomes and halflings... I am forever in the water during the lich phase... worst mechanic ever..... -100
3nd I don't play pet classed that are strong enough to kill the eggs so I have to fight every spider add... -1000
4th Because I'm always fighting the pathing chasing the lich, I'm constantly fighting mummies and the lich actually gains health back... -10000
5th in the off chance I get to shadownutjob, my dudes are all over the place and I end up back in the GL.. -100000
Final score.... stupid.
1st off this takes for F'n forever...dumb -1
2nd I play gnomes and halflings... I am forever in the water during the lich phase... worst mechanic ever..... -100
3nd I don't play pet classed that are strong enough to kill the eggs so I have to fight every spider add... -1000
4th Because I'm always fighting the pathing chasing the lich, I'm constantly fighting mummies and the lich actually gains health back... -10000
5th in the off chance I get to shadownutjob, my dudes are all over the place and I end up back in the GL.. -100000
Final score.... stupid.
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Probably one of the most melee unfriendly missions I can think of. But even my casters are constantly hung up in the geometry, I keep a close eye on their aggro and if they aren't a few points into it then I know they're lost somewhere and stuck on something!
1) With decent dps, it takes less than 10 minutes.
2) Barbarian campfire
3) Just place 3 melee toons in each of 3 rooms, and keep your tank fighting the queen inside the 4th room (only the tank, keep the healer/bard outside). Just keep those 3 toons in those rooms until the last egg is dead at 20%, then just /mode chase with all toons again. Takes a little while, but the spider queen has low hp.
4) Its really not bad with barbarian + chase mode...my toons are basically glued to the lich.
5) All toons should be on chase, just pause/twist off bard and pop DA immediately. Or, spread toons out a bit, pop valias bravery on everyone, wait for echos to explode, then just just mode assist burn shalowain. It's really not that bad, unless your you aren't using CWTN plugins or dps is very low.
Gnome-eater
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The event is annoying, but massive dps does tend to trivialize it. I don't need to burn the lich, which makes shalowain get like 1 emote in before she dies now. It's a lot more tolerable.
Gnome-eater
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I run a parser. If the numbers aren't climbing, they aren't attacking. DPS meter overlay
Undefeated
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Where is the video?
I've seen it, was linked on the official forums. It isn't exciting at all, he just burns the ever living fuck outta blob/spider/lich/shal right on their spawn points, gg. I don't think that is possible with KA/CWTN though, you need to be mashing burn buttons faster using some key broadcast commands (which is what the user claimed, and makes sense).
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Plugins and macros are 99% of the time faster than humans. The delay you see is to cope with EQ being old and piled birds nest of code... key broadcasters wont change a game flaw.
in context of many previous expacs , this is not a difficult nor particularly frustrating mission
End of Empires in ROS. true fuckery
Fight Fire in TBL. some things you can't teach a virgin, you had to experience it for yourself
Myriad Smoke Trials in TBL- Cyclone, Riddles, Ashes Glory .. many nightmares
Chamber of Tears - true tears
Pricklor in TOV- get under the flying griffon,
Narandi - which narandi melting? don't keel the wrong one
Avatar in TOV - bend the knee - Oh nos, something is autostanding my toons
Aaryonar - COV
basically long list of every other mission from the last 5 expacs are harder than this one
End of Empires in ROS. true fuckery
Fight Fire in TBL. some things you can't teach a virgin, you had to experience it for yourself
Myriad Smoke Trials in TBL- Cyclone, Riddles, Ashes Glory .. many nightmares
Chamber of Tears - true tears
Pricklor in TOV- get under the flying griffon,
Narandi - which narandi melting? don't keel the wrong one
Avatar in TOV - bend the knee - Oh nos, something is autostanding my toons
Aaryonar - COV
basically long list of every other mission from the last 5 expacs are harder than this one
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CoV has entered the forum...
I don't know what the actual clickies in this mission are for, but I think they banish you
I don't even understand how that big of a gap between my group's DPS and that guy's exists. My crew is at or nearly fully max AA with T3 LS weapons + dmg augs and I struggle to kill the blob before it emotes (using CTWN plugins). I'm genuinely befuddled...
I had the same problem, after an hour of experimentation I finally got them to follow across the canals on CWTN chase. Dropped lev, hit everyone except SK with air elemental illusion. Why that works and plain lev doesn't is beyond me. Also, SK (a troll) never has a problem crossing the canals, but troll illusion does not help the chase toons.
Yah same...insane
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Edited to add, I don't know how to make a LEM out of this so it's all manual at this point...
Running a KissAssist group I took @jb321 's script and modified it. I'm now able to win this although I still have to drive my SK and frequently alt-tab to other characters. For example, if my mage doesn't follow and get close to the egg sacs then I'll get spider adds every time. My group makeup has 4 pet classes but the mage pet is the win on the egg sacs.
So KA will attempt to run the SK to the egg sac and /chase on will usually mean the other chars follow him, but many times the other chars will get stuck and I have to run them manually.
The Lua helps manage each phase taking a bit of the load off me as I try to drive the SK. Everyone is running KA in normal assist mode and with /chase on. The SK runs in Tank mode. KA can be really stupid about targeting especially when the mob won't populate the extended target window, so the Lua will pause KA and manually target the mobs.
Edit to add that I also do
Also edit to add I also have an MQEvent added for this to help drag the pets back off the Queen when she runs away....
[CODE title="MQ2 Event"][ForgeSpider]
trigger=#*#The Spider Queen scuttles off to the#*#
command=/multiline ; /timed 1 /mqp on ; /timed 2 /pet stop ; /timed 3 /pet backoff ; /timed 4 /pet follow ; /timed 6 /mqp off
[/CODE]
I yanked the comments out for readability. Anyone with a bit of code knowledge should be able to read it directly...
[CODE lang="Lua" title="Lua Helper for Heroes Forge mission"]-- hf.Lua for Heroes Forge mission, BigDaddy, 1/1/2024
-- most code stolen from other contributors!
local mq = require('mq')
print ("Starting Heroes Forge / KissAssist Helper Lua")
local countera = 0
local counterb = 0
local counterc = 0
local counterd = 0
local countere = 0
local function moving() while mq.TLO.Nav.Active() do mq.delay(100) end end
local function handleAoEEvent()
print ("Entering handleAoEEvent")
if mq.TLO.Me.Buff('Song of Echoes').ID() then
mq.cmd('/g I have the AOE debuff, running to safe spot')
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/nav locyxz 568 -1317 327')
moving()
while mq.TLO.Me.Buff('Song of Echoes').ID() do mq.delay(1000) end
mq.cmd('/g AOE debuff is gone, resuming')
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Shalowain')
moving()
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
end
end
while mq.TLO.Zone.ShortName() == 'herosforge_mission' do
mq.delay(1000)
print ("In zone, Lua active, not in combat yet...")
while mq.TLO.Zone.ShortName() == 'herosforge_mission' and mq.TLO.Me.Combat() do
print ("Entering Main Loop")
mq.cmd('/hidecorpse npc')
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#A huge slime')() > 0
and countera == 0 then
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/chase on')
mq.cmd('/camphere off')
countera = countera + 1
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Queen of the Spiders')() > 0
and mq.TLO.SpawnCount('egg sacs')() > 0 then
mq.delay(2000)
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/target egg_sacs')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/target egg_sacs')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/switchnow')
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('a widowmaker')() > 0
and mq.TLO.SpawnCount('egg sacs')() < 1 then
mq.delay(2000)
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/target a_widowmaker')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/target a_widowmaker')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/switchnow')
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 then
if mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "ENC" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "WIZ" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "NEC" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "MAG" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "SHM" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "CLR" and
counterb == 0 then
mq.cmd('/chase off')
mq.cmd('/meleeon 0')
counterb = counterb + 1
end
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').Distance() > 49 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').PctHPs() > 10 and
counterb == 0 then
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/chase off')
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Lich')
moving()
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Shalowain')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').PctHPs() < 7 and
counterc == 0 then
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Shalowain')
moving()
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/meleeon 1')
counterc = counterc + 1
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Shalowain')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Shalowain').PctHPs() < 99 then
handleAoEEvent()
end
mq.delay(1000)
end
end
[/CODE]
Running a KissAssist group I took @jb321 's script and modified it. I'm now able to win this although I still have to drive my SK and frequently alt-tab to other characters. For example, if my mage doesn't follow and get close to the egg sacs then I'll get spider adds every time. My group makeup has 4 pet classes but the mage pet is the win on the egg sacs.
So KA will attempt to run the SK to the egg sac and /chase on will usually mean the other chars follow him, but many times the other chars will get stuck and I have to run them manually.
The Lua helps manage each phase taking a bit of the load off me as I try to drive the SK. Everyone is running KA in normal assist mode and with /chase on. The SK runs in Tank mode. KA can be really stupid about targeting especially when the mob won't populate the extended target window, so the Lua will pause KA and manually target the mobs.
Edit to add that I also do
/dge /xtar set 1 groupassisttarget
when I start KissAssist on all my characters so that they'll add the MA's target to their xtar 1 slot! This helps immensely!Also edit to add I also have an MQEvent added for this to help drag the pets back off the Queen when she runs away....
[CODE title="MQ2 Event"][ForgeSpider]
trigger=#*#The Spider Queen scuttles off to the#*#
command=/multiline ; /timed 1 /mqp on ; /timed 2 /pet stop ; /timed 3 /pet backoff ; /timed 4 /pet follow ; /timed 6 /mqp off
[/CODE]
I yanked the comments out for readability. Anyone with a bit of code knowledge should be able to read it directly...
[CODE lang="Lua" title="Lua Helper for Heroes Forge mission"]-- hf.Lua for Heroes Forge mission, BigDaddy, 1/1/2024
-- most code stolen from other contributors!
local mq = require('mq')
print ("Starting Heroes Forge / KissAssist Helper Lua")
local countera = 0
local counterb = 0
local counterc = 0
local counterd = 0
local countere = 0
local function moving() while mq.TLO.Nav.Active() do mq.delay(100) end end
local function handleAoEEvent()
print ("Entering handleAoEEvent")
if mq.TLO.Me.Buff('Song of Echoes').ID() then
mq.cmd('/g I have the AOE debuff, running to safe spot')
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/nav locyxz 568 -1317 327')
moving()
while mq.TLO.Me.Buff('Song of Echoes').ID() do mq.delay(1000) end
mq.cmd('/g AOE debuff is gone, resuming')
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Shalowain')
moving()
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
end
end
while mq.TLO.Zone.ShortName() == 'herosforge_mission' do
mq.delay(1000)
print ("In zone, Lua active, not in combat yet...")
while mq.TLO.Zone.ShortName() == 'herosforge_mission' and mq.TLO.Me.Combat() do
print ("Entering Main Loop")
mq.cmd('/hidecorpse npc')
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#A huge slime')() > 0
and countera == 0 then
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/chase on')
mq.cmd('/camphere off')
countera = countera + 1
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Queen of the Spiders')() > 0
and mq.TLO.SpawnCount('egg sacs')() > 0 then
mq.delay(2000)
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/target egg_sacs')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/target egg_sacs')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/switchnow')
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('a widowmaker')() > 0
and mq.TLO.SpawnCount('egg sacs')() < 1 then
mq.delay(2000)
mq.cmd('/mqp on')
mq.cmd('/target a_widowmaker')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/target a_widowmaker')
mq.cmd('/pet attack')
mq.cmd('/pet qswarm')
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/switchnow')
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 then
if mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "ENC" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "WIZ" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "NEC" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "MAG" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "SHM" or
mq.TLO.Me.Class.ShortName() == "CLR" and
counterb == 0 then
mq.cmd('/chase off')
mq.cmd('/meleeon 0')
counterb = counterb + 1
end
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').Distance() > 49 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').PctHPs() > 10 and
counterb == 0 then
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/chase off')
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Lich')
moving()
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Shalowain')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Lich')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Lich').PctHPs() < 7 and
counterc == 0 then
mq.cmd('/nav spawn #Shalowain')
moving()
mq.cmd('/mqp off')
mq.cmd('/meleeon 1')
counterc = counterc + 1
end
if mq.TLO.SpawnCount('#Shalowain')() > 0 and
mq.TLO.Spawn('#Shalowain').PctHPs() < 99 then
handleAoEEvent()
end
mq.delay(1000)
end
end
[/CODE]
Group make up?
I've done this with:
KA
SK, SHM, BER, BER, BRD, BST - Cake
SK, SHM, MNK, BER, BRD, BST - Cake
SK, SHM, WAR, BER, BRD, BST - Cake
SK, SHM, BER, BER, ENC, BST - Roughest
SK, SHM, BER, ROG, BRD, MAG - Mostly Cake
SK, SHM, BER, WIZ, BRD, BST - Extreme Cake - Not even close to seeing a mummy.
SK, CLR, BER, ROG, BRD, BST - Bothed, got a mummy, WIN!
SK, CLR, BER, RNG, BRD, BST - Mostly Cake - 2 pet classes with weapons, good enuff! WIN!
SK, PAL, BER, SHM, BRD, BST - One step below Extreme Cake - but Shalo was on a ledge and tank didn't get agro, so I ate the note, WIN!
SK, DRU, BER, SHM, BRD, BST - Tasty Cake, Way easier than I thought...
All these combos can get all 3 cheevs.
T2-T3 LS GG , T2-T3 LS Weapons.. a couple not maxed AA
If on blob and they are bout to get the aura I blast with HT, I don't do anything special for spider, if Lich looks like they gonna birth a mummy, I hit a couple of dmg AA's.. and then full burn on Shalo
Not using any tributes or trophies, should I spose
I have not been able to get any achievements via TA..
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