Question - Bezerker dps much lower than wizard in group (1 Viewer)

[CunningRunt]

Hey folks, I recently returned to the game and using MQ2Bezerker plugins along with the POC MQ2Wizard.

My Wizard is my main toon and got raid gear from TOV and burning lands.

I recall zerkers outdps my wizard on raids many times so scratching my head as to why both my zerkers are so far behind.
Using 2HS blood soaked axe on one zerker and haven't got the slot 3 augs LRAE faycite but really its so bad cleric is outDPS the zerkers - yes undead but still.

I must have a bad config or missing some vital skill - checked the missing items from the plugin and nada

Any ideas why zerker is so low compared? Maybe test using kissassist ? Do zerkers have a duel wielding proficiency that I am missing like the tank classes? I think not since my lower lvl zerker is not using 2HS and still getting low dps compared.
Both zerkers have about 43k aa - mostly auto-grant - any particular aa I need to check for example ?
Any threads on zerker dps at 113 - 125 that folks can point me to please?

 

[Sic]

You should use an actual parser, not dpsadv.

Your filters can impact what is shown.

And why is your engage time so varied? This is going to give you problems

You really want to use something like eqlogparser, and get some accumulated parsers so you can see.

What is your hdex on zerk (hdex, not dex) you need well over 2k to shine.

Imo you want the zerkers specific 37 delay weapon.

Does your zerk have max focus legs and arms?

Familiar/mount/janns veil?

Focus aas are very important, so are regular aas.

Zooming to max level without AAs has a huge negative impact on your dps, you need to fix that, because it isn't comparable

 

[Nunyo]

Are you sure you have axes in your inventory?

 

[Rare Spawn]

+1 On EqLogParser.

GitHub - kauffman12/EQLogParser: Everquest Log Parser for Live and TLP servers

Everquest Log Parser for Live and TLP servers. Contribute to kauffman12/EQLogParser development by creating an account on GitHub.

github.com

 

[DEADCiTiES]

Do you have your abilities hotkeyed so you can see them activate? I would spend some time paying close attention to what's happening on their screens during battle. It looks like they're missing a large chunk dps that you'd expect from them.

Check if you have the required axes. You'll need Axe of the Conqueror and Axe of the Vindicator for the level 118 Berzerker. Axe of the Vindicator and Axe of the Mangler for the 113.

 

[durango773]

in before fabled fishing pole and shurkins.. but def look into EQLP.. cause you can use it to look at whats being fired.

 

[Balkotor]

Yo have all components to do automatic the summonnaxes? Remember the comparación of DPS can be with same stuff zekers can do a lot of burst DPS but in long fights the DPS declives a bit

 

[CunningRunt]

Great suggestions and checks to do thanks folks!
Anyone know of any specific zerker dps threads and setups I can compare please? I'll focus on one zerker 118 in faded wax group gear using rankII tomes - and thanks for the hdex pointer sic that is the first thing I will sort out

 

[Sic]

Great suggestions and checks to do thanks folks!
Anyone know of any specific zerker dps threads and setups I can compare please? I'll focus on one zerker 118 in faded wax group gear using rankII tomes - and thanks for the hdex pointer sic that is the first thing I will sort out

There are a lot, probably more for zerkers than other classes, did you search

 

[Saffron]

Epic? Progression? Missing books? AA? Augs and gear? Just guessing but most raiders have those things covered and comparing to an alt missing those things won't make much sense. Some say EQ is a game of inches but I like to think of it in terms of %. Either way it all adds up.

 

[JustGlassin]

its most likely just DPS adv - that shit mislead me so hard about my groups DPS, it feels practically useless. im sure theres some way to change the filters so it actually works but it doesnt really give you any info to let you know that the readings are basically just nonsense otherwise. for me it was showing my ranger as way higher dps than the rogue even though it was the complete opposite, it just seemed to mostly only track spell damage and only some types of melee.

before you fuss over anything else definitely use the real log parser and get an accurate measure.

 

[Mikey02]

Combined several raids to give a better picture of where all the classes are at. All classes are using CWTN plugins.

I have 2 berserkers, one is raid geared other one is group stuff mostly still.

 

[Sic]

parses without context really mean little, the post above not showing crit rate really hurts being able to have a decent understanding of somewhat where each individual toon is on gear (at least for melee) - i point that out because one zerker is nearly half of another

it is very important to learn/understand how to use a parser rather than "big number means win"

many folks forget that movement = waste and you should strive for making the fewest/shortest movements allowed to be successful

coordinating glyph/7th usage to tie-in to when you're going to get the most from it, etc

 

[Mikey02]

There is really no context, it's just a combination of raids to average out the classes where they stand over the span of 20 minutes. As I've stated, one berserker is raid gear while the other one is group gear still, which is why there's a big difference in number. This is hardly big numbers, especially when comparing to real raids.

Ignore anything that's not top 10. Top 10 are my most geared groups.

I've included the crit rate in this one.

 

[Cluebot]

The bottom zerker looks like spent some time dead or something. 500s ish vs 1200ish for the other

 

[Daxchu]

I don't watch dps meters much but decided to run logs for a few hours of just standard group exp grind and was a bit surprised at the dps output of my warrior tank using LS 2hander (Bardiche of Perpetual Reverie) compared to my zerker also running LS 2hander (Poleaxe of Perpetual Reverie) both running cwtn plugins.

Combined numbers from a bit over 2.5 hours show the warrior with about a 10% higher dps rate than the zerker. This seems to be in all the standard mob fights. Longer boss fights or when burning the zerker jumps ahead of the warrior. For reference, this particular group makeup (war, ber, rog, shm, rng, brd) is to level up new rng(120) and rog(121) rest are 125 maxed AAs.

war: 57.71 %crit, 28.7 %lucky, 174,736 avg hit, 298,616 avg crit, 1,568,324 max hit
ber: 79.42 %crit, 39.56 %lucky, 149,273 avg hit, 176,153 avg crit, 1,973,535 max hit

No complaints about the zerker numbers, just really happy and definitely surprised at the warrior's performance. Wondering if part of that is due to the LS zerk weapon being a 2hs instead of some slower 2hb.

 

[Mikey02]

Warrior is king of adps. You don't need to do much aside from getting the proper ADPS support and they push out decent numbers.

 

[Sic]

Wondering if part of that is due to the LS zerk weapon being a 2hs instead of some slower 2hb.

zerker wep is 37 delay, which is slower than the typical 2hb which have (recent history) been 36

37 8=====D

 

[RobRenfro]

What server do you play on? If it's FV I can help you with Zerker weapons just tell me what level you need. But it will have to wait until my move is done. I won't have my PC just my phone for 7-10 days

 

[darbes]

If you haven't played in awhile, wizards did get some love with recent expansion and arent as lack luster as they used to be. Seen some wizards burning 5-6 million dps recently.

 

[Eltai86]

There is really no context, it's just a combination of raids to average out the classes where they stand over the span of 20 minutes. As I've stated, one berserker is raid gear while the other one is group gear still, which is why there's a big difference in number. This is hardly big numbers, especially when comparing to real raids.

Ignore anything that's not top 10. Top 10 are my most geared groups.

I've included the crit rate in this one.

View attachment 60979

I think the point is that context still matters because of how adps works. You could do 10 hrs of raiding with a berserker in one group configuration/adps call downs etc and get very different results just by changing group configuration between them. While gear/augs matter group configuration also does have an effect just as much as gear/augs or even more potentially.

Warrior is king of adps. You don't need to do much aside from getting the proper ADPS support and they push out decent numbers.

To enhance on this warriors are an absorber they can make use of basically every adps support from other melee particularly ber (hello crippling blow chance when you’re crit capped), bst (hhe, gba, synergy), mnk (synergy), brd (everything a bard brings for melee), ranger (ggotf, synergy), shm (epic)

I don't watch dps meters much but decided to run logs for a few hours of just standard group exp grind and was a bit surprised at the dps output of my warrior tank using LS 2hander (Bardiche of Perpetual Reverie) compared to my zerker also running LS 2hander (Poleaxe of Perpetual Reverie) both running cwtn plugins.

Combined numbers from a bit over 2.5 hours show the warrior with about a 10% higher dps rate than the zerker. This seems to be in all the standard mob fights. Longer boss fights or when burning the zerker jumps ahead of the warrior. For reference, this particular group makeup (war, ber, rog, shm, rng, brd) is to level up new rng(120) and rog(121) rest are 125 maxed AAs.

war: 57.71 %crit, 28.7 %lucky, 174,736 avg hit, 298,616 avg crit, 1,568,324 max hit
ber: 79.42 %crit, 39.56 %lucky, 149,273 avg hit, 176,153 avg crit, 1,973,535 max hit

No complaints about the zerker numbers, just really happy and definitely surprised at the warrior's performance. Wondering if part of that is due to the LS zerk weapon being a 2hs instead of some slower 2hb.

See post above but warriors basically absorb everything. Get those hdex numbers up for the ber and war and you’ll be even happier. For perspective a nos raid geared war without burns with proper adps support could sustain well over a million in nos. That’s before the weap boosts, increased levels, utilizing burns and the change to battle leap that happened since LS release

 

[Mikey02]

I think the point is that context still matters because of how adps works. You could do 10 hrs of raiding with a berserker in one group configuration/adps call downs etc and get very different results just by changing group configuration between them. While gear/augs matter group configuration also does have an effect just as much as gear/augs or even more potentially.

I could've been more clear on this one. All my groups are essentially built the same way between melee and caster group. 1 tank / 1 shaman / 1 bard / 1 bst then the last 2 are either necro, mage, wizard for caster or rogue, berserker or ranger for melee. Only one group I have that doesn't follow that I use cleric and an ench instead.

I do try to feed one primary melee and one primary caster group first before everyone else until I get the rest of the raid caught up.

 

[Eltai86]

I could've been more clear on this one. All my groups are essentially built the same way between melee and caster group. 1 tank / 1 shaman / 1 bard / 1 bst then the last 2 are either necro, mage, wizard for caster or rogue, berserker or ranger for melee. Only one group I have that doesn't follow that I use cleric and an ench instead.

I do try to feed one primary melee and one primary caster group first before everyone else until I get the rest of the raid caught up.

Exactly, so someone looking at that outcome you posted could draw different conclusions then what a solid raid style caster group would look more like mag/mag/nec/enc/brd and then a dru or shm for example

 

[Mikey02]

I may rotate out a melee group for a pure caster group with no tank eventually. At this point, it's hard to justify a caster group over melee with the new weapons using automation.

 

[Eltai86]

I may rotate out a melee group for a pure caster group with no tank eventually. At this point, it's hard to justify a caster group over melee with the new weapons using automation.

Are you raiding or doing group content? My point was less so melee vs caster and more so adps composition for the group.

I do agree LS is gracious in that regard in raid environment but being too shifted one way or the other can leave you chasing flavor of the month when someone gets boosted/nerfed or a mechanic requires you having a good balance

 

[Sic]

Are you raiding or doing group content? My point was less so melee vs caster and more so adps composition for the group.

I do agree LS is gracious in that regard in raid environment but being too shifted one way or the other can leave you chasing flavor of the month when someone gets boosted/nerfed or a mechanic requires you having a good balance

fortunately boxing and even personas offer to help fill that gap, but yep 100% right

a lot of folks who box raids by themselves don't keep a rng, which hurt them - a lot of folks going into shei didn't have a paladin, which hurt them as examples

 

[Mikey02]

Are you raiding or doing group content? My point was less so melee vs caster and more so adps composition for the group.

I do agree LS is gracious in that regard in raid environment but being too shifted one way or the other can leave you chasing flavor of the month when someone gets boosted/nerfed or a mechanic requires you having a good balance

This is my raid parses. I basically run all classes minus druid and monk at this point and my raid is fairly balanced as far as melee and caster goes. This is just what I am typically seeing in raid. IMelee is dominating parses unless it's in an encounter where there's absolutely no movement at all, even then melee is still winning.

There's a raid where mobs are resistant to melee so having casters is important.

As far as ADPS goes, I've kept mostly the same across the board. A bard, shm, beastlord at a minimum. Even throwing an enc into the mix for caster group, I am not seeing them being as high as melee. What more surprising is how Beastlords are performing this expansion. Would be curious to see how their monk counterpart is doing.

 

[Eltai86]

This is my raid parses. I basically run all classes minus druid and monk at this point and my raid is fairly balanced as far as melee and caster goes. This is just what I am typically seeing in raid. IMelee is dominating parses unless it's in an encounter where there's absolutely no movement at all, even then melee is still winning.

There's a raid where mobs are resistant to melee so having casters is important.

As far as ADPS goes, I've kept mostly the same across the board. A bard, shm, beastlord at a minimum. Even throwing an enc into the mix for caster group, I am not seeing them being as high as melee. What more surprising is how Beastlords are performing this expansion. Would be curious to see how their monk counterpart is doing.

View attachment 61008

Monks and bers both are juiced right now. Shm/brd/bst/mnk/ber is juiced and can add war, sk, rng, or rog in there for more juice. I personally run 4 rangers in my armies which allows a ~80% uptime on tb/mgb called auspices over 9 and 18 min time windows. Similarly have 6 bsts and call down tb/mgb paragons with high uptime.

My necs and mags are doing decently with

Dru/brd/enc/mag/mag/nec or Dru/brd/enc/nec/nec/mag configurations

Just looking at the raw crit rate posted for your casters it looks like they could be suffering from lack of crit rate mods which is hurting your dps.

 

[Eltai86]

fortunately boxing and even personas offer to help fill that gap, but yep 100% right

a lot of folks who box raids by themselves don't keep a rng, which hurt them - a lot of folks going into shei didn't have a paladin, which hurt them as examples

Ya still have to level/aa and manage the care and feeding of the box/persona.

Fully agree, I think a lot see the raw dps numbers of classes and overlook contributed dps that other classes provide to each other or the raid force as a whole. Auspice basically puts most casters near 100% spell/dot crit rate on its own with any small additional boost (bard epic or fierce eye) on top.

 

[Mikey02]

Aside from bard epic and auspice, how else do you boost caster crit rate as far as gear goes. I don't think the type 5 does anything for caster like it does with melee.

If you don't mind, could you post parses with multiple raids combined so I can have a basis of comparison? I am looking for ways to improve my casters as they're just severely lacking for me right now.

 

[Eltai86]

Aside from bard epic and auspice, how else do you boost caster crit rate as far as gear goes. I don't think the type 5 does anything for caster like it does with melee.

If you don't mind, could you post parses with multiple raids combined so I can have a basis of comparison? I am looking for ways to improve my casters as they're just severely lacking for me right now.

As far as gear goes, there is no way to improve caster crit rate. This entirely about usage of abilities. Each class has their own options typically as well as support classes that also provide additional.

Going to cover this by posting detailed relevant material:
Take a look here, for general caster Adps

Caster ADPS Guide

docs.google.com

Necro:

The Raiding Necro Guide

docs.google.com

Mag:

NoS Raiding Magician Guide

docs.google.com

Are a few to get you started, I heavily recommend people be joining relevant class discords. There is a ton of knowledge there


As far as parses I’ll have to try and get a clean compilation of them put together