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Question - 120 Necro Raid load out discussion

Granditos

Granditos

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Was in a debate last night with a group of raid necros. No one agreed on the best layout for raid DPS. It came down to picking 2 of these spells:

Ecliptic paroxysm 6
The protectors grasp
Twilight leech
Call skeleton mass


Here are some of the comments:

- paroxysm doesn’t benefit from twin cast and is mana expensive
- twlight leech doesn’t get an AA focus line
- swarm pets parsed terribly and causes additional raid lag. My thought was we were just missing pet hits being too far out of range or something.
- no negatives on protectors grasp

Side comment was swapping ignite and decomp if fighting a plant based raid target. We assume the mushrooms are plants.


What you’ll think?
 
Granditos said:
Was in a debate last night with a group of raid necros. No one agreed on the best layout for raid DPS. It came down to picking 2 of these spells:

Ecliptic paroxysm 6
The protectors grasp
Twilight leech
Call skeleton mass


Here are some of the comments:

- paroxysm doesn’t benefit from twin cast and is mana expensive
- twlight leech doesn’t get an AA focus line
- swarm pets parsed terribly and causes additional raid lag. My thought was we were just missing pet hits being too far out of range or something.
- no negatives on protectors grasp

Side comment was swapping ignite and decomp if fighting a plant based raid target. We assume the mushrooms are plants.


What you’ll think?
Click to expand...


Parox also doesn’t get modified by focus effects so no boost to damage, duration, cast range or mana preservation.

It also comes down to the event and raid force approach. If you’re on an add heavy event you aren’t getting through most of your dot lineup because your best and first choice is to pyre everything first.

What were the other 11 spell slots you were having loaded? I feel like the lineup I had looked at doing for some custom code I was writing had 3 of those 4 in it (no parox), but not at home with my notes.

I haven’t run exact numbers since the last patch (necro swarm pets got modified in that patch), but before they were extremely powerful and a should be being used in the priority casting.

Also check out this resource:

docs.google.com

The Raiding Necro Guide

The Raiding Necro Cassiera <Silent Redemption> Note: This is always a work in progress. Feel free to direct any constructive criticism to @Cassiera on Discord, and/or join the Necro Discord. Basic Do’s and Don’ts Swift DoTs are not for raids (honestly, they aren’t for anywhere, but definitely ...
docs.google.com docs.google.com
 
Eltai86 said:
Parox also doesn’t get modified by focus effects so no boost to damage, duration, cast range or mana preservation.

It also comes down to the event and raid force approach. If you’re on an add heavy event you aren’t getting through most of your dot lineup because your best and first choice is to pyre everything first.

What were the other 11 spell slots you were having loaded? I feel like the lineup I had looked at doing for some custom code I was writing had 3 of those 4 in it (no parox), but not at home with my notes.

I haven’t run exact numbers since the last patch (necro swarm pets got modified in that patch), but before they were extremely powerful and a should be being used in the priority casting.

Also check out this resource:

docs.google.com

The Raiding Necro Guide

The Raiding Necro Cassiera <Silent Redemption> Note: This is always a work in progress. Feel free to direct any constructive criticism to @Cassiera on Discord, and/or join the Necro Discord. Basic Do’s and Don’ts Swift DoTs are not for raids (honestly, they aren’t for anywhere, but definitely ...
docs.google.com docs.google.com
Click to expand...
Proclamation for Blood
Malevolent Conjunction
Infected Wounds
Pyre of Va Xakra
Scalding Shadow
Extinction
Fleshrot's Grip of Decay
Ignite Cognition
Pyre of the Neglected
Hemorrhagic Venom
The Protector's Grasp
Zelnithak's Pallid Haze
Ecliptic Paroxysm

Here is what we were doing. But maybe switching Ecliptic Paroxysm with Swarm is the way to go...?
 
Proclamation for Blood
Malevolent Conjunction - Mind Atrophy (Conjunction spell has a terrible return value on it).
Infected Wounds
Pyre of Va Xakra
Scalding Shadow
Extinction
Fleshrot's Grip of Decay
Ignite Cognition
Pyre of the Neglected
Hemorrhagic Venom
The Protector's Grasp
Zelnithak's Pallid Haze
Ecliptic Paroxysm - Swarm (this isnt a bad spell, just swarms are better).
 
I thought Necro meta involved swapping spell sets mid-event because there's too much for one spell bar.
 
durango773 said:
Proclamation for Blood
Malevolent Conjunction - Mind Atrophy (Conjunction spell has a terrible return value on it).
Infected Wounds
Pyre of Va Xakra
Scalding Shadow
Extinction
Fleshrot's Grip of Decay
Ignite Cognition
Pyre of the Neglected
Hemorrhagic Venom
The Protector's Grasp
Zelnithak's Pallid Haze
Ecliptic Paroxysm - Swarm (this isnt a bad spell, just swarms are better)
durango773 said:
Proclamation for Blood
Malevolent Conjunction - Mind Atrophy (Conjunction spell has a terrible return value on it).
Infected Wounds
Pyre of Va Xakra
Scalding Shadow
Extinction
Fleshrot's Grip of Decay
Ignite Cognition
Pyre of the Neglected
Hemorrhagic Venom
The Protector's Grasp
Zelnithak's Pallid Haze
Ecliptic Paroxysm - Swarm (this isnt a bad spell, just swarms are better).
Click to expand...
interesting on conjunction. It is super mana expensive but haven’t heard that swap before. What about putting twilight leech in instead of mind atrophy. Mind atrophy’s cast time is always what turns me away.
Click to expand...
 
Many_Whelps said:
I thought Necro meta involved swapping spell sets mid-event because there's too much for one spell bar.
Click to expand...
I think that mostly ended with the dot revamp they did a couple of years ago. They upped dot damage and removed the ability to stack previous dots from the same line. Reduced the need to swap.
 
So malovent uses alot of mana, unless you have gina for it, will bounce, still charge you the mana cost, and out you on cooldown to use it. And I run Mind Atrophy as ADPS, your mana hungry classes will love you for it (shouldnt stack necros in same raid groups)

Weve also covered this in another thread, its 54 sec long on a 60 sec cooldown. your not going to be casting it that much.
 
durango773 said:
Proclamation for Blood
Malevolent Conjunction - Mind Atrophy (Conjunction spell has a terrible return value on it).
Infected Wounds
Pyre of Va Xakra
Scalding Shadow
Extinction
Fleshrot's Grip of Decay
Ignite Cognition
Pyre of the Neglected
Hemorrhagic Venom
The Protector's Grasp
Zelnithak's Pallid Haze
Ecliptic Paroxysm - Swarm (this isnt a bad spell, just swarms are better).
Click to expand...

Drop conjunction and Parox is the way I would go.
 
Granditos said:
Yep, we used that one too. And it specifically says not to use swarm pets as some raids don’t allow them. But it doesn’t include any information on swarm per performance.
Click to expand...
Depending on lag many guilds banned many swarm pets but a lot of that was focused at the crap aa swarms almost all classes had.
 
Here are the numbers for a parse on guild dummy- all running with no bard and no burn. Twilight Leech is off the table. Swarm is a single pet now.

Twilight Leech- 1.2mil
Protectors Grasp- 3mil
Ignite Cog- 1.8mil
Call Skeleton Mass- 1.3mil
Ecliptic Paroxysm- 1.9mil

Swarm pet will benefit from so many of the melee buffs during a raid is definitely going back in the rotation, even with the low DPS. And pretty much same DPS put out from Ignite as Paroxysm, so why waste all the mana on Paro?
 
Last edited:
Granditos said:
Here are the numbers for a parse on guild dummy- all running with no bard and no burn. Twilight Leech is off the table. Swarm is a single pet now.

Twilight Leech- 1.2mil
Protectors Grasp- 3mil
Ignite Cog- 1.8mil
Call Skeleton Mass- 1.3mil
Ecliptic Paroxysm- 1.9mil

Swarm pet will benefit from so many of the melee buffs during a raid is definitely going back in the rotation, even with the low DPS. And pretty much same DPS put out from Ignite as Paroxysm, so why waste all the mana on Paro?
Click to expand...
Were these single spell casts?
 
Single casts aren’t going to tell the whole story because of things like focus effects, crit chance and twin casts. I’m going to guess that protectors grasp may have been a twincast that caused the damage to be much higher
 
Eltai86 said:
Single casts aren’t going to tell the whole story because of things like focus effects, crit chance and twin casts. I’m going to guess that protectors grasp may have been a twincast that caused the damage to be much higher
Click to expand...
You were right, went back and averaged. That Grasp was twincast.

Grasp is 1.4mil- 1.5mil
Paroxysm is 1.6mil -1.8mil
 
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Question - 120 Necro Raid load out discussion
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