Question - Why use 2 mez songs for bard?

[whytdrumer]

Is there a way to only use the AE mez spell instead of both single target and AE? I want to make my BRD a little more versatile and helpful and I feel like having two mez spells is not needed. Could I just use the AE spell and change it from 3 mobs to 2 mobs so he always uses his mez on adds?

Would this cause an endless loop if the group is attacking one mob while bard is mezzing the second? I know the bard would mez both mobs but I would be attacking one so it would immediately break the mez, correct?

Thanks.

 

[Sic]

I personally almost always only have my bard using aoe mez, which gets broken on primary mob, which is np

for kiss, keep in mind that a mez broken message makes it reset their mez timer, so it'll remez everything because it doesn't know who got mez broken

 

[whytdrumer]

I personally almost always only have my bard using aoe mez, which gets broken on primary mob, which is np

for kiss, keep in mind that a mez broken message makes it reset their mez timer, so it'll remez everything because it doesn't know who got mez broken

Cool that's good to know. If it restarts the meztimer that shouldn't be a problem though right because the bard stops all other songs to mez anyway? When would the timer being rested be an issue?

 

[Sic]

Cool that's good to know. If it restarts the meztimer that shouldn't be a problem though right because the bard stops all other songs to mez anyway? When would the timer being rested be an issue?

Well, the timer restarting issue is a problem because if it prioritizes mez and then thinks it needs to mess everything that it already mess now is not going to be singing any other songs or doing anything else

 

[whytdrumer]

Well, the timer restarting issue is a problem because if it prioritizes mez and then thinks it needs to mess everything that it already mess now is not going to be singing any other songs or doing anything else

Ah, see I thought that's what it already did. I thought when my bard is mezzing it's not singing any other songs or attacking. Is there a way around this? Maybe having the bard ignore the mez-breaking issue or only have the bard check /tar 2 or checking a target that is not the MA's target?

 

[LorDeth]

I personally almost always only have my bard using aoe mez, which gets broken on primary mob, which is np

for kiss, keep in mind that a mez broken message makes it reset their mez timer, so it'll remez everything because it doesn't know who got mez broken

So, that being said, does that mean by doing an AE mez, it isnt going to try and re-mez each individually after the first one is (re)cast? Or is it going to try casting the AE mez on EACH mob it thinks it needs to remez?

If it can be limited to only doing the one re-mez by using only the AE mez, then thats a big improvement, allowing the bard to go back to other duties in the meantime...

 

[Sic]

So, that being said, does that mean by doing an AE mez, it isnt going to try and re-mez each individually after the first one is (re)cast? Or is it going to try casting the AE mez on EACH mob it thinks it needs to remez?

If it can be limited to only doing the one re-mez by using only the AE mez, then thats a big improvement, allowing the bard to go back to other duties in the meantime...

I would reset their mez timers and try and remez as soon as it can - aoe mez isn't insta reuse

I haven't used kiss in a while, but i don't believe the mezziing reset on a break has changed - it was something that caused me some heartache in the past

 

[Leo]

Most of the time, I have my bard only using AE mez as well. In your kiss ini file, change MezOn=1 to MezOn=3. Then I change the number after the AE mez song to |2. That way if there is at least 1 add it will not switch targets and instead use the AE mez song to mez the add. I do sometimes switch this on the fly in game by just using the slash command. I have 2 hotkeys on my tank that switch mezzing type. /dex bardname /mezon 3 to switch to AE mez only and /dex bardname /mezon 1. If you use multiple different bards you could modify the invis key that Sic uses with the broadcast command that has the /if classname bard do /mezon 3 and the other key the same but /mezon 1. Lots of options but I adjust them situationally based on my needs.

 

[LorDeth]

I would reset their mez timers and try and remez as soon as it can - aoe mez isn't insta reuse

I haven't used kiss in a while, but i don't believe the mezziing reset on a break has changed - it was something that caused me some heartache in the past

Yeah I was thinking that, the AE mez is much slower cooldown than the single target one.. and how it would deal with that..

Not using kiss?

Got a secret /cough mq2bard /cough up your sleeve?

Most of the time, I have my bard only using AE mez as well. In your kiss ini file, change MezOn=1 to MezOn=3. Then I change the number after the AE mez song to |2. That way if there is at least 1 add it will not switch targets and instead use the AE mez song to mez the add. I do sometimes switch this on the fly in game by just using the slash command. I have 2 hotkeys on my tank that switch mezzing type. /dex bardname /mezon 3 to switch to AE mez only and /dex bardname /mezon 1. If you use multiple different bards you could modify the invis key that Sic uses with the broadcast command that has the /if classname bard do /mezon 3 and the other key the same but /mezon 1. Lots of options but I adjust them situationally based on my needs.

hmm interesting approach.. I think i'm going to have to play with this a bit and see how it works with my current playstyle.. only one bard tho ! I'd have to dump a zerker if I added a second bard!

 

[whytdrumer]

Great feedback thanks everyone. So, what if instead of the AE mez I only used single target mez? This would solve the problem of the group breaking the mez and causing the timer to reset. Would this then allow the bard to still attack and do his thing? I feel this option would have a cap of mobs, say 3-5 adds before it starts to hurt.

 

[Leo]

So, that being said, does that mean by doing an AE mez, it isnt going to try and re-mez each individually after the first one is (re)cast? Or is it going to try casting the AE mez on EACH mob it thinks it needs to remez?

If it can be limited to only doing the one re-mez by using only the AE mez, then thats a big improvement, allowing the bard to go back to other duties in the meantime...

When using MezOn=3 which is the AE mez only mode for mezzes, the bard does not switch targets, he just stops his twist real quick, casts the AE mez song, then resumes twisting. If you have a solid tank/healer this is the most efficient way to do it. Keep in mind that based on level and AAs, there can be a short downtime in which the AE mez is still on cooldown but the mez spell wears off the adds. At max level and AAs it's very minimal something like 1 or 2 seconds. With my tank being raid geared I have been able to use this approach with 8 adds and not wipe, but obviously, your results will vary based on your setup.

 

[Sic]

When using MezOn=3 which is the AE mez only mode for mezzes, the bard does not switch targets, he just stops his twist real quick, casts the AE mez song, then resumes twisting. If you have a solid tank/healer this is the most efficient way to do it. Keep in mind that based on level and AAs, there can be a short downtime in which the AE mez is still on cooldown but the mez spell wears off the adds. At max level and AAs it's very minimal something like 1 or 2 seconds. With my tank being raid geared I have been able to use this approach with 8 adds and not wipe, but obviously, your results will vary based on your setup.

yep, that's what i suggest doing in many/most cases

 

[Leo]

Yeah I was thinking that, the AE mez is much slower cooldown than the single target one.. and how it would deal with that..

Not using kiss?

Got a secret /cough mq2bard /cough up your sleeve?



hmm interesting approach.. I think i'm going to have to play with this a bit and see how it works with my current playstyle.. only one bard tho ! I'd have to dump a zerker if I added a second bard!

I'm only using 1 bard as well. The multiple bards would be if you have different groups that use different bards. I happen to run 4 different group comps between my 6 accounts so I created that modified key so I didn't have to constantly change the bard key with the /dex bardname if I had a different bard in my group.

 

[Leo]

Great feedback thanks everyone. So, what if instead of the AE mez I only used single target mez? This would solve the problem of the group breaking the mez and causing the timer to reset. Would this then allow the bard to still attack and do his thing? I feel this option would have a cap of mobs, say 3-5 adds before it starts to hurt.

To only use the single target mez you would want MezOn=2 I believe. I have personally never used that option though. If I'm worried about the AE mez not working well enough, I'd switch it to MezOn=1 and then set the AE mez to like |3 or |4 so it would use the standard single target mez for 1 or 2 additional adds, then 2 or 3 or more additional adds it opens with AE mez then cycles through single target mezzes. MezOn=2 only using single target seems very situational, but in my opinion, just using the AE mez is a much better option.

 

[whytdrumer]

To only use the single target mez you would want MezOn=2 I believe. I have personally never used that option though. If I'm worried about the AE mez not working well enough, I'd switch it to MezOn=1 and then set the AE mez to like |3 or |4 so it would use the standard single target mez for 1 or 2 additional adds, then 2 or 3 or more additional adds it opens with AE mez then cycles through single target mezzes. MezOn=2 only using single target seems very situational, but in my opinion, just using the AE mez is a much better option.

Yeah with that approach it doesn't accomplish my goal of freeing up one of the spell slots. I'm going to try the AE mez only and see how things go for a bit. Thanks for all the feedback everyone. This was super helpful and informative.

 

[LorDeth]

Yeah with that approach it doesn't accomplish my goal of freeing up one of the spell slots. I'm going to try the AE mez only and see how things go for a bit. Thanks for all the feedback everyone. This was super helpful and informative.

Yeah agreed, good info!! I'm going to make these changes as well!

 

[Zeusdracco]

hah. amazing. i had absolutely no clkue about mez 2/3... i just thought it was the number of mobs it will cast its mez at if in camp. ie if it set to 2... it casts if there r 2 or more. set to 3 it casts at 3 or more.

This makes alot more sense. thank you

 

[Leo]

hah. amazing. i had absolutely no clkue about mez 2/3... i just thought it was the number of mobs it will cast its mez at if in camp. ie if it set to 2... it casts if there r 2 or more. set to 3 it casts at 3 or more.

This makes alot more sense. thank you

Just to clarify:

MezOn=1 - uses both AE mez and single target mez. AE mez use is determined by the |# or greater after the AE spell in the subsection once that number of mobs is reached. It starts with pulsing the AE mez, then recycles through all the targets using single target mez. If the number of mobs in camp is less than the |# after the AE mez spell, it will use the single target mez spell.

MezOn=2 - only uses single target mez spell regardless of the number of mobs in camp.

MezOn=3 - only uses the AE mez spell once the number of mobs meets and/or exceeds the |# listed after the AE mez spell.

I just don't want anyone to get confused by the differences between the MezOn=# which determines the mez modes and the |# which is after the AE mez spell which determines how many mobs to start using the AE mez spell if in MezOn= modes 1 or 3.

 

[LorDeth]

been using it an hour or so, with good results so far!

Zeus, so that means in my mez section,
[Mez]
MezOn=3 <--------------- First change , so im only using the AE mez now
MezRadius=40
MezMinLevel=95
MezMaxLevel=118
MezStopHPs=90
MezSpell=Slumber of Zburator
MezAESpell=Wave of Sleep|2 <------ second change, so my AE mez triggers on 2 mobs in camp (my primary target, plus 1 or more adds)

 

[Leo]

been using it an hour or so, with good results so far!

Zeus, so that means in my mez section,
[Mez]
MezOn=3 <--------------- First change , so im only using the AE mez now
MezRadius=40
MezMinLevel=95
MezMaxLevel=118
MezStopHPs=90
MezSpell=Slumber of Zburator
MezAESpell=Wave of Sleep|2 <------ second change, so my AE mez triggers on 2 mobs in camp (my primary target, plus 1 or more adds)

Exactly. That's how I typically run too. Very rarely do I bother doing anything other than that. It allows the bard to focus on dps/adps and cycle the AE mez spell when necessary without having to change targets.

 

[Many_Whelps]

How are you running out of spell slots? Modern bards only have a few good songs worth twisting anyways. I have the opposite problem, I have shit mem'd that never gets used.

Edit: I suggest going in the opposite direction. Use single target mez, but set you number of targets to something 4+ so that you are only mezzing when you get a really big train.

 

[Silverspaceman]

I personally almost always only have my bard using aoe mez
I haven't used kiss in a while

Hmmmmm...

Yeah with that approach it doesn't accomplish my goal of freeing up one of the spell slots. I'm going to try the AE mez only and see how things go for a bit. Thanks for all the feedback everyone. This was super helpful and informative.

I changed over to what Sic suggested and just run BRD AOE mez. Works fine. Seems to spend less time, generally medding, especially with 3+ mobs in camp.

 

[B_I_G__D_A_D_D_Y]

How are you running out of spell slots? Modern bards only have a few good songs worth twisting anyways. I have the opposite problem, I have shit mem'd that never gets used.

Edit: I suggest going in the opposite direction. Use single target mez, but set you number of targets to something 4+ so that you are only mezzing when you get a really big train.

I pretty much use them all, even if they aren't of much benefit at times. There's no limit how many things can be active in the song window...

MeleeTwistWhat=7 8 9 10 11 4 3 2 1 6 5

Buffs8=EclipticPsalm|endgroup|75
Buffs9=Ecliptic Psalm|managroup|95

Gem1=Aria of Pli Xin Liako
Gem2=War March of Centien Xi Va Xakra
Gem3=Pulse of Nikolas
Gem4=Kai's Reckless Renewal
Gem5=Sogran's Insult
Gem6=Nord's Disdain
Gem7=Coagulus' Chant of Disease
Gem8=Cruor's Chant of Poison
Gem9=Shak Dathor's Chant of Flame
Gem10=Sylra Fris' Chant of Frost
Gem11=Chorus of Shei Vinitras
Gem12=Composite Psalm
Gem13=Wave of Nocturn

Edited to add the one line that maybe has wiped my group more than any other as I leveled up. Forgetting to adjust that would be comical as I stood there not mezzing the hot mess because suddenly they were ABOVE the mez limit!

MezMaxLevel=123

 

[nuggy]

i use mez 1 . works way better with allot a mobs ,, aoe is to slow to recast ... if dooing shei you will want the singe target on a hot key makes it cake to run..

 

[Zeusdracco]

heh. wow. came back to look at this just before i am about to head out to pick up wife. almost ended up leaving late. gonna come back and read this a bit better later. some really good stuff here. Thx guys

 

[2ndGoat]

heh. wow. came back to look at this just before i am about to head out to pick up wife. almost ended up leaving late. gonna come back and read this a bit better later. some really good stuff here. Thx guys

The wife can wait. :-p

 

[Hylander]

few things to remember on bard AE mez
1) range is REALLY small only 35 units,
2) Line of Sight needed, AND
3) 30second cooldown

so its not pumping out lullabies to all nearby mobs all the time.

 

[Many_Whelps]

I pretty much use them all, even if they aren't of much benefit at times. There's no limit how many things can be active in the song window...

MeleeTwistWhat=7 8 9 10 11 4 3 2 1 6 5

You'd get more dps out of your bard if you just did aria, war march, 4x dots and used insult more often.

 

[Hylander]

You'd get more dps out of your bard if you just did aria, war march, 4x dots and used insult more often.

replace single target mez with 2nd insult = win

 

[Many_Whelps]

replace single target mez with 2nd insult = win

Really only needed if you want to use back-to-back insults. but you can generally use a single insult every 3rd song in a melody.

 

[B_I_G__D_A_D_D_Y]

You'd get more dps out of your bard if you just did aria, war march, 4x dots and used insult more often.

I have to admit that I rarely parse my group. I also don't play a bard IRL or even as a sort of main in game. I mostly read the song descriptions and thought they might help my entire group survive better. So, some of my song selections are to help out my tank and my mage get a little boost to their dps and survival. As to the insult songs I hate their knockback effects so am happy to use them sparingly.

As to the person who said, "The wife can wait.", obviously is married to a saint. Or he's not married at all! (PS this is a joke!)

 

[timmy]

nord's disdain has no push, BG. sogran's has a baby push. so, ditch that sogran's and your push problems are solved ~

also, how in the name of cazic do you guys keep your mana pool anywhere above 10 using 2 insults? what kind of mana pools are you rocking?

also:

 

[durango773]

also, as a side note, there is a limit on short term buffs (song window), of 24, then they populate your long term buff window.

 

[Dragonslayer]

@Many_Whelps : what would be the setting for kissassist, to hold mezzing unless at least 3 or 4 mobs are on aggro?
As far as I know, single mezzing is set to start, as soon as more than 1 mob is on aggro.

 

[B_I_G__D_A_D_D_Y]

also, how in the name of cazic do you guys keep your mana pool anywhere above 10 using 2 insults? what kind of mana pools are you rocking?

374k MP on my bard. I use rods and all my chars use their feathers and horns constantly. And stuff doesn't stay alive very long ...

 

[Many_Whelps]

@Many_Whelps : what would be the setting for kissassist, to hold mezzing unless at least 3 or 4 mobs are on aggro?
As far as I know, single mezzing is set to start, as soon as more than 1 mob is on aggro.

I use hotkeys to toggle MezOn from 0 to 1 when I want to mez and back to 0 when I don't. I usually don't mez because it's a waste of time and I'd rather AoE anyways.