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Question - Meshgenerator and Pulling priority

Joined
Oct 21, 2020
RedCents
443¢
So i have been messing around with MeshGenerator to try to get my puller to focus on pulling along certain paths to get to named. I was curious on how the weight distances(area types) apply to pulling. Does it take into consideration the weighted areas while pulling or does it simply just take actual nav distance?

I have been pulling in a zone with teirs and can only seem to get it to stop pulling the room directly above if i put not walkable area. So just trying to figure out if I'm wasting my time with this approach of pulling with weighted paths......
 
So i have been messing around with MeshGenerator to try to get my puller to focus on pulling along certain paths to get to named. I was curious on how the weight distances(area types) apply to pulling. Does it take into consideration the weighted areas while pulling or does it simply just take actual nav distance?

I have been pulling in a zone with teirs and can only seem to get it to stop pulling the room directly above if i put not walkable area. So just trying to figure out if I'm wasting my time with this approach of pulling with weighted paths......
You should consider using my paths.

Also, as mentioned z axis for various tools is important.

Weights are good - but if you have dynamic updates on, that changes things - and if you're not using very large weights you might not get the results you want
 
So i have been messing around with MeshGenerator to try to get my puller to focus on pulling along certain paths to get to named. I was curious on how the weight distances(area types) apply to pulling. Does it take into consideration the weighted areas while pulling or does it simply just take actual nav distance?

I have been pulling in a zone with teirs and can only seem to get it to stop pulling the room directly above if i put not walkable area. So just trying to figure out if I'm wasting my time with this approach of pulling with weighted paths......

Without knowing what you are using to pull it's difficult to know how to assist with this question because it presents new questions that if left unanswered will only complicate the response.

The short answer is you need to limit the pulling z height to be below the room above you as the simplest method. CWTN Plugins has this option - but you don't appear to be using them.

While MQ2Nav is technically a 2d navigation, it takes slopes and step height into consideration on the ability to access specific areas. So depending on if the way up is a slope or a step you could make adjustments that would disallow access, but this is essentially the same thing as marking the area unwalkable, but it would potentially affect other areas of the zone as well.

Does MQ2Nav take the weight into account? Yes. It 100% does. Getting a path length is the same as generating a path because it can't know the length without first knowing what path it would take.

Weighted areas won't solve the issue you have with pulling because weighted doesn't mean can't go there, simply means you should avoid going there unless you have no choice (this is an over simplification).

Less simple: Consider an area with a weight of 20, and a 1:1 normal navigational area. For every 1 step in the weighted area it will need to be worth 20 steps in an unweighted area. If the destination is in the weighted area this simply means it will walk around the edge of the weighted area until it needs to walk into the weighted area, taking the shortest distance from the outside edge to the destination.

If you have a weighted area that looks like an 8, it's possible that it would prefer to cross in the middle of the 8 to get to the other side as opposed to walking all the way around, because if you need 2 steps at a weight of 20 to cross between the top and bottom of the 8 but it takes 80 steps to go all the way around then 40 steps is less than 80 steps and thus it would cut through the weighted area because it's less steps. So while having a weighted area can make it avoid going through it, if the path to go around is still greater, then it will still go through it. To fix this, you could simply assign an absurd weight to the avoidance volume to make it impossible to want to go into the area, but again this only applies to paths that will not end inside the weighted area because if it's the destination, eventually it must enter. Using a preferred path makes it 0.5 weight, meaning it takes two steps to make 1 normal step, and essentially doubles any weights around it. If you put a weighted area and then generated a preferred path inside of the avoidance it would prefer to take that path.

The only way to not go in an area is if the program doesn't tell it to go there (filter out the specific mob, z height, etc), or if you break the mesh's path using unwalkable. You don't need to make the entire area unwalkable, just seal it off from the rest of the mesh.

Again, the right way would be to limit your z axis as has been mentioned, because if the zheight from the camp location/starting point exceeds the limitation of the spawnsearch then it's not a valid pull target, and thus never telling nav you want to go there in the first place. So it's possible the tool you are using has this option built in somehow, or if you are the author of the tool you're using then it should be considered for addition to filter out things in areas above and below you. This will prevent modifying your mesh based on what camp you are in, and allow for modifications dynamically as your needs change.
 
The path idea... Great idea. That's how I do a lot of swarm killing BS, just follow a path, if Me.XTarget > SomeSafe#OfMobs, kill the pack where I'm at, else just keep following the path.

Putting weights on things could get a little complicated, and I personally don't like making things more complicated than they should be. For how long will you be in the zone? How many toons are you dragging along with you? Are the areas populated with other players? How much do you care about efficiency?

Editing your mesh to make places unwalkable is generally regarded as a bad idea... for stability reasons. You never know when you'll get summoned to an un-navable spot and get rekt. It happens. Just run along a path, time the spawns, or find someone that has made a Z-Axis weighted pull routine (I'm sure it exists, I've just never knowingly used it... and writing it sounds like it's wayyyy more complicated than just running between a couple of camp areas).
 
The path idea... Great idea. That's how I do a lot of swarm killing BS, just follow a path, if Me.XTarget > SomeSafe#OfMobs, kill the pack where I'm at, else just keep following the path.

Putting weights on things could get a little complicated, and I personally don't like making things more complicated than they should be. For how long will you be in the zone? How many toons are you dragging along with you? Are the areas populated with other players? How much do you care about efficiency?

Editing your mesh to make places unwalkable is generally regarded as a bad idea... for stability reasons. You never know when you'll get summoned to an un-navable spot and get rekt. It happens. Just run along a path, time the spawns, or find someone that has made a Z-Axis weighted pull routine (I'm sure it exists, I've just never knowingly used it... and writing it sounds like it's wayyyy more complicated than just running between a couple of camp areas).
zaxis weighted pulling sounds like a simple script to me assuming the tool you're using allows you to modify the zradius pulling. Simply check things in a zhigh difference equivalent to the current floor mobs range, when the spawncount for the spawnsearch is zero (nothing else to pull) your script would increase it to include the next floor. When something on the first floor respawns, reset to the single floor. rinse and repeat as needed for as many height variations as is viable. Could write a script to do it for the cwtn plugins for sure.
 
You should consider using my paths.

Also, as mentioned z axis for various tools is important.

Weights are good - but if you have dynamic updates on, that changes things - and if you're not using very large weights you might not get the results you wan
Are the waypoint out yet? in my Meshgenerator its marked as "coming soon"

I was using a 50 weight, figured that would be large enough. But limiting the Z axis hurts the other pulling paths. So cant limit simply by Z axis.

Does MQ2Nav take the weight into account? Yes. It 100% does. Getting a path length is the same as generating a path because it can't know the length without first knowing what path it would take.

Weighted areas won't solve the issue you have with pulling because weighted doesn't mean can't go there, simply means you should avoid going there unless you have no choice (this is an over simplification).

Less simple: Consider an area with a weight of 20, and a 1:1 normal navigational area. For every 1 step in the weighted area it will need to be worth 20 steps in an unweighted area. If the destination is in the weighted area this simply means it will walk around the edge of the weighted area until it needs to walk into the weighted area, taking the shortest distance from the outside edge to the destination.

If you have a weighted area that looks like an 8, it's possible that it would prefer to cross in the middle of the 8 to get to the other side as opposed to walking all the way around, because if you need 2 steps at a weight of 20 to cross between the top and bottom of the 8 but it takes 80 steps to go all the way around then 40 steps is less than 80 steps and thus it would cut through the weighted area because it's less steps. So while having a weighted area can make it avoid going through it, if the path to go around is still greater, then it will still go through it. To fix this, you could simply assign an absurd weight to the avoidance volume to make it impossible to want to go into the area, but again this only applies to paths that will not end inside the weighted area because if it's the destination, eventually it must enter. Using a preferred path makes it 0.5 weight, meaning it takes two steps to make 1 normal step, and essentially doubles any weights around it. If you put a weighted area and then generated a preferred path inside of the avoidance it would prefer to take that path.

The only way to not go in an area is if the program doesn't tell it to go there (filter out the specific mob, z height, etc), or if you break the mesh's path using unwalkable. You don't need to make the entire area unwalkable, just seal it off from the rest of the mesh.

Again, the right way would be to limit your z axis as has been mentioned, because if the zheight from the camp location/starting point exceeds the limitation of the spawnsearch then it's not a valid pull target, and thus never telling nav you want to go there in the first place. So it's possible the tool you are using has this option built in somehow, or if you are the author of the tool you're using then it should be considered for addition to filter out things in areas above and below you. This will prevent modifying your mesh based on what camp you are in, and allow for modifications dynamically as your needs change.


I set the weighted area, hallway, as 50, still went in there to pull, maybe because it is trying to pull those mobs from within the weighted area and thats why they went into it?
 
Are the waypoint out yet? in my Meshgenerator its marked as "coming soon"

I was using a 50 weight, figured that would be large enough. But limiting the Z axis hurts the other pulling paths. So cant limit simply by Z axis.




I set the weighted area, hallway, as 50, still went in there to pull, maybe because it is trying to pull those mobs from within the weighted area and thats why they went into it?
Again, weights are just that - weights for determining navigation route, but if it is a mob you've indicates (via whatever pulling options whatever automation you're using) then the mesh weight has no bearing on deciding to pull that or not - just got to get there.

Re: waypoints - mq2nav has waypoints, but as I said, you should use mypaths Lua script, I was not talking about meshgen or even mq2nav waypoints.

@burdsjm mypaths suggestions?
 
Yeah, this is like a 15-minute thing for sure with Mypaths. You go to the spot you want to start and set your group to chase mode with the tank in Sic Tank mode. Load up mypaths and name the route. On the record tab, you can hit record and walk the path you want while invisible. You can make it a straight line or a loop. Then, just uninvis and hit play, and as long as you check the interrupts to pause the pathing while in combat, it will just farm an area for you on repeat.

If you don't want to record the path, you can just hit the add waypoint button, run to the other spots you want, and hit add waypoint. It's super easy and, in my opinion, one hell of an underappreciated Lua. If you get advanced, you can add commands to run when you get to waypoints. Like /multiline ; /cwtn mode chase; /timed 10 /shd mode 7; /timed 20 /target flare; /timed 30 /say here to face; /timed 40 /say battle;
 
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Question - Meshgenerator and Pulling priority

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