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The Golden Trio :) (1 Viewer)

M

meeskino

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May 16, 2009
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Hi guys,

I been playing clr/mag/shm for past 6 months I returned to EQ from long afk.

It's quite clear by now, that merc tanks are teh suck and the group is far from "perfect" in long run.

So I thought about rerolling.

Possible options:

1. SK, Mag, Shm
2. War, Rog, Shm

With what would you go? Or you have better trio to play? Cons and pros?
 
I play Sk/Rng/Shm

I have no problems doing T5 named. If I were to Re-roll anything I would switch my ranger out for a zerker. Though Ranger buffs are nice, my buddy plays a zerker and our 4 toons with mercs were able to take down Keloss This weekend.

Shaman is a must have, Sk makes an awsome tank because of the Tap AA's once maxxed, doubles as FD puller with instant aggro. Only reason Id take Zerker over a Rog is positioning for the Rog can be a bitch sometimes, also Mq2melee positioning can be noticed by anyone with any knowledge of mq2.

A third Pro is when I dont have $$ for a 3rd toon Sk/Shm makes a fantastic duo. Finding a dps pickup is not hard to get.


Sidenote: T1-T3 Mercs do suck, Get to T4-T5 Arent so bad but My Sk far surpasses it and only have 2 pieces of raid gear just to max Shielding Avoidance. Keloss this weekend was a good test for a t5 war merc and after his disc dropped he was mowed right over plus he only averages 700-800 DPS, I Average 1400 on the SK, Zerker Always parses in the 2-3kDPS, with a burst of 5k+

And if I havent pushed the sk enough yet, HT 4tw 29k initial and 12k DoT every tic over 1 min(Maxxed Ranks I can use every 22 min)
 
i like monk war shaman. which i feel i can do a lot with my monk has nice dps and so does the war when i get him more dps aa. always need a shaman for buffs slows haste extra healing. monk and war can tank a lot of things with 2 t5 mercs. i also have a wiz bard ranger/rogue that i box when i want more dps
 
today was doing tosk. t5 tank, 2 t5 cleric mercs. 1 on balanced other on reactive. mercs were close FM all the time, but still managed to get my tank killed twice to trash...awesome
 
Sk is where I put all my harder work all T5 group gear, 1 Lastblood and the earring from Kellos(4shielding 20avoidance). Weapons/Range from RCC. All augs are AC augs 20 and up which are all groupable. A few are 2 - 4 shielding. Fairly easy to get. (We have done circle of Drakes DoN Raid with just Sk/Zerker/Shaman) 4shielding 90hp/mana slot 7/8. AC / Shielding is King. The other big factor is the AA's for CA/CS/TotC Max TotC I Can crit my buffed Lifetap proc for 6k+ no joke.

Ranger is T4/T5 Group Weapons

Both Shm & Rng are just T4 Group Geared with only a couple T5 Pieces. Arms for Shammy Healing I think is 55% increase to healing. Arms Legs are important for ranger for Cleave and Ferocity

All Have 2.0's (If you have access to a cleric you can get 2.0's in a weekend np) We do Anguish with 1 group. My Team + a buddy's Clr/Bst/Zerker. Ture is a joke/Hanvar has 8 billion frigin hp with insane regen, First time took us over an hour and clr had full mana the entire time. second time swapped the gimp bard we had with for his Bst and did it in 45 min.

All in All is just Farming time. Anyone who 3 the right combo boxes should be able to get to T5 without too much hassle.

Meek Drop 1 of those dps for a Shaman. Slows are key to EVERYTHING. If you wanted a Melee/Slower roll a Bard I would personally Drop that monk you can pull with Sk. Also With a Sham give you a small amount of Crowd control with Virulent Paralasys.

As I stated before, only thing I would change if I didint have a ton of AA into my Rng I would build a Zerker. There arent alot of em around on our server and I dont know why, they are ridiculous dmg.

As far as those mercs, I use 2 clrs and a War(incase I die he picks up to finish the battle. As far as you dying 2x last night. Are you setting group roles? We usually only need the 1 Cleric, unless in a t5 zone always try to have 2 incase I am not paying attention to spot heals or am dotting on Shm.

Ok I'm done rambling on for now, thats my team, of all the toons Ive ran in the last 9 years, I enjoy this team the most. I Hope this helps you make a decision.
 
Seems all I need to do is get my SK upto T5 level then, my Bst and Ranger are already fully T5 geared, my SK is still 70, AAs are just easy to get at that level so keeping him there for a while.
 
SK, monk, shaman ftw.

A fully heal AA'd shaman can heal very nicely, plus buff, haste, slow, and most importantly LYNX. Lynxed pets are VERY nice dps, especially early on when your weapons suck.

Monk with discs can outdps a rogue atm (sad but true). That will eventually get fixed but even if it does monk is still the choice because of pulling. An SK can pull, but can't mez and calm. A monk/SK combo can pretty much team pull anything using calm, mez, and snare.
Monk is also a viable offtank (we use monk offtank on keldovan, languished converts, and lashers in Anguish for example), and master's aura prevents ripostes, which is $$$.

SK goes full defensive AAs + lifetap AAs, buff duration (important!), feign through spells hitting, AA snare (VERY VERY IMPORTANT!), some utilities (hate step, death peace, invis, itu, VOT and such).

SHM goes full healing + subtlety, union of spirits, turgur's swarm, virulent paralysis, radiant cure, quick buff (VERY important), buff duration, canni5, mana regen. Make SURE to get Champion spell!

MNK goes full dps AAs, blink, run8, rapid feign, imitate death, feign through spells hitting, all that pulling goodness.

Then have SHM get warrior merc and the other two get clerics. You should only need 1 of the clerics up unless you're doing T5 named, and even that will be 1-cleric doable once the SK hits 4000 unbuffed AC + high avoidance/shielding and defensive AAs.


If you're going to add more to that combo, add DPS and maybe have a side chanty for chanty buffs and charm for certain situations.

Rogue is nice for new poisons (which give great DPS boost for anyone swinging a weapon, INCLUDING shaman swinging his hand of holy vengeance V weapon) and is easy to multibox, plus very good sustained non-disc dps and godly short term disc dps.

Wizard is higher dps but higher maintenance and doesn't really help group dps.

Mage isn't worth it, nor is beastlord (if either of those tops your raid DPS parse, either your monks, rogues, wizards and necros SUCK or you need to find someone else to do raid groups).

Epic necro with anguish BP can pwn on long term fights (especially with rogue toxicity!) but sucks at short term DPS on trash.

You could maybe swap out a rogue for a ranger (decent DPS, and predator and group DPS AAs are nice for burns). I don't bother, myself.

I'm ambivalent about zerkers. They have to burn endurance to keep up with regular DPS and that axe shit is annoying. Rogues are easier.


I've played every class to 85 + at least 1000 aas each, and I've found that SK, SHM, MNK, ROG, ROG, merc CLR works best for tankability, sustained dps, burn dps, and low maintenance.
 
runnin a shaman monk wizzy atm, quite good, mq2melee the monk, big nuke on whizzy here and there and heal em up on the shaman, dont really use mercs unless im feelin lazy, warrior merc keeps the pulls constant and cleric merc i just have to slow, champion and panther. In the end i got slow heals buffs snare ports and dps. Monks a decent tank as well once you get 600aas or so
 
I know alot of people like the monk but pretty hard to hit 5k AC without Raiding on a leather class. Not sure what thier soft cap is. Also the begining of this post explained that Meek did not like the tank merc and wanted to build a new team instead of relying on it. So was looking for alternatives.
 
SHD, MAG, SHM is hard to beat. Working on T5 tank and levels for shaman so only have a low tier healer and 2 t5s.

Mage is very easy to box. Their built in tank stuns and can withstand alot of punishment even without pet focus. Add in pet AA and the fairly easy to attain pet focus from void progression and you end up with something that can easily handle singles up to kuua theme named. The swarm pet spell can even stand toe to toe with an unforeseen add for a little while, and usually picks up aggro with the small initial dd component of the spell. And then you have the mage nuking on top of all that.
 
nyghteyes said:
I know alot of people like the monk but pretty hard to hit 5k AC without Raiding on a leather class. Not sure what thier soft cap is. Also the begining of this post explained that Meek did not like the tank merc and wanted to build a new team instead of relying on it. So was looking for alternatives.
Click to expand...

The monk doesn't need 5k ac. He just needs enough to offtank easier shit like spawned adds or the like (if you don't feel like AE aggroing with the SK). 3500 is more than plenty for that.
Not even an SK can achieve 5K unbuffed AC without raid gear. 4500 is about the best you'll get if you want to maximize your shielding and avoidance.

If adds do come, you can either abort by feigning off, or if an add is already in camp use virulent paralysis. Or if your SK is beefy enough set your merc to reactive, disc and tank 2 at once.
 
I'm in similar situation tho I just duo war+mage with t5 cleric. I tried an sk before but dropped because the dps is way lower than the wars. If you have to split something its easy enough with coth. Also wars mitigate more dmg and makes the job easier for the merc/ heler.
 
Aye, plus you can tank heavy nameds with discs. I have always had trouble pickin sk vs war, because the sk is damn fun to play- but when it boils down the war is superior.
 
War was intended to be a superior tank and in a Raid War is far better, but in a long fight or xp grinding I would take a sk over a War anyday due to the massive amount of hp taken in by proc taps which is less mana for the healers to spend. DPS may be less but I average 1400-1500 dps with my sk. Dunno what you mean by heavy named other than Raid mobs. My example before was Kellos, Granted a war merc t5 isnt very comparable to a Real War but my group geared sk out tanked it 10 fold.
 
A fully AA'd warrior takes far more mana to keep healed than a fully AA'd SK.
However, a warrior's disc now reduces damage by 45% (compared to SK's 25%), which is very nice when dealing with boss mobs. But then again, how often are you going to do that?

Usually you are doing trash and group named. SK needs less heals than a warrior on trash, and more heals than a warrior on named. So ask yourself, which will you be tanking more often?
 
If you tank group mobs that hit semi hard you would as a knight use a 1h+shield. Your dps is now the lowest a char can produce, vs a war that uses dw that while being best for agro also typically is his best dps setup.
About the discs, they are completely different. SK disc takes 25% of every until it reaches approx. 20k and it only lasts 1minute.
Warrior disc takes 45% of the mobs DI table which means if a mob hits for 1000 max it will now only hit for 550, and it lasts 3mins.

I honestestly dont believe you do 1400-1500dps average, raid geared knights with around 2kaa's dont do that on burn fights..
 
Jensen said:
About the discs, they are completely different. SK disc takes 25% of every until it reaches approx. 20k and it only lasts 1minute.
Warrior disc takes 45% of the mobs DI table which means if a mob hits for 1000 max it will now only hit for 550, and it lasts 3mins.
Click to expand...

My point is that any named fight will not last more than 1 minute unless your dps is sucking ass (I rarely see that happen). My malarian carapace always outlasts the named (at least it did back when I actually needed to use it on nameds).
For long fights with big nasty mobs with lots of HPs then warrior is the obvious choice. Warrior is the uncontested king of raid mobs.
However, the clerics in my guild agree that I'm easier on their mana (probably because my lifetap procs give me anywhere from 2k to 18k hps).


I honestestly dont believe you do 1400-1500dps average, raid geared knights with around 2kaa's dont do that on burn fights..
Click to expand...

That's because you don't play an SK.

Me -vs- Rottrued the Twisted: -- DMG: 315433 -- DPS: 3219 -- Scaled: 3154 -- Slash: 144898 -- DirDmg: 120256 -- DoT: 50279 -- Non-crit rate: 90.4% -- crit rate: 9.6% -- Attempts: 196 -- Hits: 166 -- Missed: 22 -- Defended: 8 -- Accuracy: 88.3% -- Avg Hit: 1900 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 33696

Me -vs- Aerius Windfury: -- DMG: 541105 -- DPS: 3260 -- Scaled: 3202 -- Slash: 197262 -- DirDmg: 177685 -- DoT: 165946 -- Bash: 212 -- Non-crit rate: 90.6% -- crit rate: 9.4% -- Attempts: 408 -- Hits: 351 -- Missed: 53 -- Defended: 4 -- Accuracy: 86.9% -- Avg Hit: 1541 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 21384

Me -vs- Augmented Iksar Sortie Soldier: -- DMG: 24399 -- DPS: 2218 -- Scaled: 2218 -- DirDmg: 17861 -- Slash: 6313 -- Bash: 225 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 24 -- Hits: 18 -- Missed: 3 -- Defended: 3 -- Accuracy: 85.7% -- Avg Hit: 1355 -- Max hit: 9586 -- DMG to PC: 9626

Me -vs- Augmented Iksar Sortie Soldier: -- DMG: 9611 -- DPS: 1922 -- Scaled: 1922 -- DirDmg: 6746 -- Slash: 2636 -- Bash: 229 -- Non-crit rate: 88.9% -- crit rate: 11.1% -- Attempts: 10 -- Hits: 9 -- Missed: 1 -- Accuracy: 90% -- Avg Hit: 1067 -- Max hit: 5373 -- DMG to PC: 4866

Me -vs- Augmented Iksar Sortie Soldier: -- DMG: 22706 -- DPS: 2838 -- Scaled: 2523 -- DirDmg: 13846 -- Slash: 8860 -- Non-crit rate: 72.7% -- crit rate: 27.3% -- Attempts: 15 -- Hits: 11 -- Missed: 3 -- Defended: 1 -- Accuracy: 78.6% -- Avg Hit: 2064 -- Max hit: 9045 -- DMG to PC: 5544

Me -vs- Augmented Iksar Sortie Soldier: -- DMG: 13544 -- DPS: 3386 -- Scaled: 2709 -- Slash: 8954 -- DirDmg: 4590 -- Non-crit rate: 57.1% -- crit rate: 42.9% -- Attempts: 7 -- Hits: 7 -- Accuracy: 100% -- Avg Hit: 1934 -- Max hit: 3219 -- DMG to PC: 1638

Me -vs- Augmented Iksar Sortie Soldier: -- DMG: 13345 -- DPS: 2224 -- Scaled: 2224 -- Slash: 9143 -- DirDmg: 4202 -- Non-crit rate: 81.8% -- crit rate: 18.2% -- Attempts: 12 -- Hits: 11 -- Defended: 1 -- Accuracy: 100% -- Avg Hit: 1213 -- Max hit: 4001 -- DMG to PC: 0

Me -vs- Vyth, Fifth Council Member: -- DMG: 285979 -- DPS: 1869 -- Scaled: 743 -- DirDmg: 119190 -- Slash: 86237 -- DoT: 80332 -- Bash: 220 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 167 -- Hits: 129 -- Missed: 33 -- Defended: 5 -- Accuracy: 79.6% -- Avg Hit: 2216 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 273859

Me -vs- Mindshear Acolyte: -- DMG: 437707 -- DPS: 1920 -- Scaled: 1911 -- DirDmg: 206935 -- Slash: 149521 -- DoT: 80332 -- Bash: 919 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 282 -- Hits: 213 -- Missed: 51 -- Defended: 18 -- Accuracy: 80.7% -- Avg Hit: 2054 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 426219

Me -vs- A Wrext Mal mundunugu: -- DMG: 184391 -- DPS: 2974 -- Scaled: 2881 -- DoT: 80332 -- DirDmg: 56807 -- Slash: 45782 -- Bash: 1470 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 87 -- Hits: 72 -- Missed: 14 -- Defended: 1 -- Accuracy: 83.7% -- Avg Hit: 2560 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 11060

Me -vs- A discord ritualist: -- DMG: 205793 -- DPS: 1979 -- Scaled: 1979 -- Slash: 89210 -- DirDmg: 67872 -- DoT: 45904 -- Bash: 2807 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 211 -- Hits: 150 -- Missed: 41 -- Defended: 20 -- Accuracy: 78.5% -- Avg Hit: 1371 -- Max hit: 28476 -- DMG to PC: 70735

Me -vs- A Sludge Lurker: -- DMG: 61013 -- DPS: 2034 -- Scaled: 2034 -- Slash: 39777 -- DirDmg: 18862 -- Bash: 2374 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 63 -- Hits: 54 -- Missed: 8 -- Defended: 1 -- Accuracy: 87.1% -- Avg Hit: 1129 -- Max hit: 6219 -- DMG to PC: 4736

Me -vs- A vitrik portal slaver: -- DMG: 10214 -- DPS: 1702 -- Scaled: 300 -- Slash: 9569 -- DirDmg: 645 -- Non-crit rate: 100% -- Attempts: 11 -- Hits: 10 -- Missed: 1 -- Accuracy: 90.9% -- Avg Hit: 1021 -- Max hit: 2927 -- DMG to PC: 0
 
My war has max aa and crys/sod raid weapons and avg dps is around 1500-2k while burn is around 3k-4k depending how lucky i am on opp strike.
 
Jensen said:
Thats very impressive! But what sorta gear are you in? is heavy raid or just group stuff?
Click to expand...

That's from an old log when I was in crystallos + MMM gear. I haven't turned on logging in awhile :)

I'm using longsword of the fanatic legion (119/33). The best dps group 1hander for SK is Rend (80/32).
There's not too much difference in spell damage between group and raid SK (75 damage focus vs 50, which in the end comes out to about 15% difference I believe).

Also, SK pet adds 300dps to all that (more if you're grouped with a shaman).
 
My knight is 1900 AA and after reading the evilgamer forums forever I belive mine are properly spent, and yes sk pet is a big boost. Also gotta remember thier proc taps are huge as stated in my first post and by kochaden and a couple other times here.

If your gonna raid and want to be a tank NOT an offtank then be a WAR, you want to be a group tank be a SK.

SoD was the best thing that ever happened to group Sk's
 
Jensen said:
Well I stand corrected, I actually have a 82 sk- perhaps I should give him a whirl ;)
Click to expand...

Have a gander at evilgamer.net
TONS of invaluable information on how the SK works. They're one of the more complex classes if you want to maximize their utility.

In particular look up spell threading. That's the key to high dps. And get a 2-hander with 35 delay or MORE :)
 
Sorry to bump the old thread- for a duo setup would SK/SHM be better than SK/WIZ or SK/mage ??

I realise I can kill faster with the dps, but would the difference in dps be worthwhile sacrificing the possibility to kill "harder" mobs with shm?
 
do SK/Shm

the buffs, the extra heals etc. these damn mercs can be really stupid.

sk/mage is nice aswell. no buffs for SK, but mage pet can tank pretty good. I had my mage air pet tanking warrens and tosk nameds np.

making lvl 85 char these days is easy. if I were you, I'd play diff combos. if you sk not great tank, then longer mob stay alive, worse for you
 
hehe, my english aint that great :) it's one of 5 languages i speak fluently

yoda english not so good aswell tho :)
 
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