Question - When does a tank become mandatory, for a TLP trio? (1 Viewer)

[RogueDuce]

This is likely a stupid question, but this is the place for those, right?

In the TLP world (in your opinion), with no intention of taking part in raid content, around what expansion do you think that a Trio, would absolutely need a tank, in order to effectively enjoy the majority of it's content? (Before Mercs)

A little theory crafting is appreciated, because the more I think about it the more I am leaning towards a (Shaman, Mage, Necro) or (Shaman, Mage, Chanter) trio...

With Shaman debuffs, mage pet-tanking, a third caster could be much of anything. And in that case, why not just make it a tank(y) class?

For example: (SK, Shaman, Mage) or even (Bard, Shaman, Mage)...

I know that most of these sorts of class composition questions/answers are self-masturbatory, if not entirely moot.
But I wouldn't mind if someone changed my mind. As a matter of fact, I would love it if someone managed to.

 

[Knightly]

That question depends entirely upon what you consider "group" content. If you're fine with not doing any raids from "previous" expansions until mitigation of the mighty is gone, then you can go forever with either of your first two combos. However, if you're trying to do previous content stuff with your group (or epic fights without a raid, even out of era) you'll have a problem with mitigation of the mighty since your shaman will be your tank.

Outside of that, with the shaman to slow and heal and assuming you're not going to do any raid mobs -- it'll be tight in Gates/Omens but both before and after that you'll be fine.

 

[RogueDuce]

That question depends entirely upon what you consider "group" content. If you're fine with not doing any raids from "previous" expansions until mitigation of the mighty is gone, then you can go forever with either of your first two combos. However, if you're trying to do previous content stuff with your group (or epic fights without a raid, even out of era) you'll have a problem with mitigation of the mighty since your shaman will be your tank.

Outside of that, with the shaman to slow and heal and assuming you're not going to do any raid mobs -- it'll be tight in Gates/Omens but both before and after that you'll be fine.

In the case of one of your scenarios, which of the Trio would you temporarily swap out for a tank?

Since the shaman is the healing...

 

[Setsuni]

Realistically your mage pet will become better then even a raid geared tank in most group content scenario's once you hit like HoT era. They start to scale like crazy.

 

[FreeloadingScrub]

It really depends on which TLP as they are all at different stages, but I tend to assume Oakwynd for the next 2 weeks unless otherwise specified.

If you're going to use a mage pet to tank before TSS you probably going to need at a raid focused pet which might be difficult if you don't raid. Early TLPs they are quite squishy and probably better off having the shaman tank.

I may be wrong but I have played a lot of TLPs and my understanding is that pet tank effectiveness starts off at absolute trash and unlocks in stages similar to the exp rate.

Also be sure to be gearing up pets if they are tanking, even if you're making sets of banded to give them before you can summon plate sets.

 

[Knightly]

I mean, mage epic from Kunark to PoP is a beast.

 

[RogueDuce]

I think I am going to run with a Bard, Shaman, Mage, trio and see where it leads me.

 

[WillardJ85]

I agree with the general consensus here, but I would also like to point out that when it comes to early TLPs (assuming no weird start/gimmicks) enchanter/cleric duos are absolutely god tier, charm is completely broken. Most group content at least up to like Pop (?) Charm pet is going to be ~70% of the total group damage while also tanking -- of course I understand that charming is more hassle than simply having a mage pet tank, but just something to consider! Cleric can complete heal, enchanter can slow/mez, then you can add a dps for your third if you so choose (or a bard if you're lazy)

 

[RogueDuce]

I agree with the general consensus here, but I would also like to point out that when it comes to early TLPs (assuming no weird start/gimmicks) enchanter/cleric duos are absolutely god tier, charm is completely broken. Most group content at least up to like Pop (?) Charm pet is going to be ~70% of the total group damage while also tanking -- of course I understand that charming is more hassle than simply having a mage pet tank, but just something to consider! Cleric can complete heal, enchanter can slow/mez, then you can add a dps for your third if you so choose (or a bard if you're lazy)

I totally agree with the Chanter + Cleric duo... I suppose I was just looking for something less micro intense. That, and if that duo is the choice, there is no reson not to throw in an SK as the third wheel. In which case, odds are I'd be good, for good.

Ugh...
Just talking about it has me second guessing myself now...

 

[WillardJ85]

The good thing is that IF you do want to go with Enchanter + Cleric, the third spot has a lot of different synergies; one being the SK you mentioned yourself, a paladin is also just as good (if not slightly better) for stun/taunting on mez breaks, LoH, backup rezzing. However, even a mage is a really good fit in that group, Malo helps a fair bit with charm duration, and you have a pet for offtanking and decent ranged dps!

That's the fun thing about theorycrafting though, so many different things are viable and "make sense". At the end of the day charming is quite micro intensive, and from personal experience it can be a bit stressful -- especially if you ever want to (or have to) take a quick break.

 

[Kookies]

If you do go enchanter, please don't ever join a group and say "I'm not a charming enchanter"

 

[RogueDuce]

The good thing is that IF you do want to go with Enchanter + Cleric, the third spot has a lot of different synergies; one being the SK you mentioned yourself, a paladin is also just as good (if not slightly better) for stun/taunting on mez breaks, LoH, backup rezzing. However, even a mage is a really good fit in that group, Malo helps a fair bit with charm duration, and you have a pet for offtanking and decent ranged dps!

That's the fun thing about theorycrafting though, so many different things are viable and "make sense". At the end of the day charming is quite micro intensive, and from personal experience it can be a bit stressful -- especially if you ever want to (or have to) take a quick break.

I have early experience with enchanter charm tanking and charm soloing, with a boxed druid, and totally understand. It's actually one of the reasons I was steering away from it in a trio.

If a trio it's too intense I may actually just end up going with a duo. At least early on when truebox rules prevent certain tools.

I've never really put much time into Paladins, so I am pretty ignorant about their capabilities overall.

 

[an_image]

This is likely a stupid question, but this is the place for those, right?

In the TLP world (in your opinion), with no intention of taking part in raid content, around what expansion do you think that a Trio, would absolutely need a tank, in order to effectively enjoy the majority of it's content? (Before Mercs)

A little theory crafting is appreciated, because the more I think about it the more I am leaning towards a (Shaman, Mage, Necro) or (Shaman, Mage, Chanter) trio...

With Shaman debuffs, mage pet-tanking, a third caster could be much of anything. And in that case, why not just make it a tank(y) class?

For example: (SK, Shaman, Mage) or even (Bard, Shaman, Mage)...

I know that most of these sorts of class composition questions/answers are self-masturbatory, if not entirely moot.
But I wouldn't mind if someone changed my mind. As a matter of fact, I would love it if someone managed to.

tank/enc/cleric is mandatory at lvl 1 since 1999...

 

[RogueDuce]

On second (third, and fourth) thought(s), I have decided to go with: "Class (Focus)"
Paladin (Sword & Board), Druid (Support, Escape), Enchanter (Buff/DeBuff).
It seems a bit unorthodox, but I think it's got legs.

 

[q8reflex]

WAR/ENC/CLR and just add pickup dps, why over thinking this matter? All TLP server die in less than a year so consider stuff up to PoP, otherwise server will feel like an Emu one we all know that.

 

[Knightly]

All TLP server die in less than a year so consider stuff up to PoP, otherwise server will feel like an Emu one we all know that.

I don’t think that’s true at all given the feedback I’ve seen from the last few TLPs. Mischief especially lasted through the last round of TLPs and I suspect Oakwynd isn’t a huge draw for people other than the crowd that habitually rerolls. But outside of those several servers went strong long past PoP (Agnarr drew a lot of the “I want to stay in PoP” crowd).

Regardless, PAL/DRU/ENC beats WAR/CLR/ENC hands down in that era, if you were only planning to go to PoP. You’re talking about a time when ports are most useful and charm is impressive DPS in its own right (with stun being super useful to rescue charm breaks). Warrior and Paladin tanking isn’t yet that far apart and Paladin can handle rez at only a 6% loss from what the cleric can do.

PoP and beyond, both are solid. I just think before PoP the former has the edge.

 

[RogueDuce]

I have nearly zero real experience with any content past early PoP, so that has heavily influenced my choice. Also, the TLP's content through POP will take mostly the first year? (44 weeks)

Having said that... If the trio proves too cumbersome to do, with my measly resources, I think I'll punt the Paladin and fall back on my old standby...

Enchanter/Druid duo.