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Question - Level 110 DPS (1 Viewer)

Joined
Sep 25, 2020
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Been playing mostly TLP's the last few years but I thought I would give Live a try again. I've been boxing lvl 110 - Pal, Enc, Mag with Wiz, Wiz, Clr mercs and having some trouble. My DPS seems just awful. I'm wondering if there is something just obvious I am missing or are lvl 110+ mobs just filthy hard to kill fast? I'm mostly just bazaar geared but I wouldn't think it matters all that much as long as you have decent AA's (mostly autogranted) and the tank geared (approx 235K hp and 6K ac buffed). I fooled around killing undead goblins in East Wastes and it was pretty slow going so I researched other places to go.

So I went to GMM and tried the Darkness Howls group mission. It was very slow but steady going until the named popped (Grash, Bloodmoon Growler - lvl 113). I could not whittle that guy down - I mean like 10+ minutes of fighting it and still not below 30% - slower than an old world raid boss. Even with Wiz mercs on burn (I always have them on burn and never have aggro issues) the DPS just sucked. Eventually your merc healer is just going to miss once, and the tank goes down when a fight is that long. Mage and Mercs were out of mana and Paladin had blown just about every trick to stay alive. Wiped when Grash was about 10% - but it must have been well over 15 minutes of fighting. Altogether, it took me a good 90 minutes to just get that far into that mission to be quite disappointed in how ridiculously hard it was.

I'm not sure at all what I am doing wrong, or is the game just this much harder on Live than, say a Gates of Discord group mini?

Thanks for any advice.
 
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Sic

[sic]
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Been playing mostly TLP's the last few years but I thought I would give Live a try again. I've been boxing lvl 110 - Pal, Enc, Mag with Wiz, Wiz, Clr mercs and having some trouble. My DPS seems just awful. I'm wondering if there is something just obvious I am missing or are lvl 110+ mobs just filthy hard to kill fast? I'm mostly just bazaar geared but I wouldn't think it matters all that much as long as you have decent AA's (mostly autogranted) and the tank geared (approx 135K hp and 6K ac buffed). I fooled around killing undead goblins in East Wastes and it was pretty slow going so I researched other places to go.

So I went to GMM and tried the Darkness Howls group mission. It was very slow but steady going until the named popped (Grash, Bloodmoon Growler - lvl 113). I could not whittle that guy down - I mean like 10+ minutes of fighting it and still not below 30% - slower than an old world raid boss. Even with Wiz mercs on burn (I always have them on burn and never have aggro issues) the DPS just sucked. Eventually your merc healer is just going to miss once, and the tank goes down when a fight is that long. Mage and Mercs were out of mana and Paladin had blown just about every trick to stay alive. Wiped when Grash was about 10% - but it must have been well over 15 minutes of fighting. Altogether, it took me a good 90 minutes to just get that far into that mission to be quite disappointed in how ridiculously hard it was.

I'm not sure at all what I am doing wrong, or is the game just this much harder on Live than, say a Gates of Discord group mini?

Thanks for any advice.
mercs are super poop unfortunately.

definitely take a loot at your AAs - focus AA is a ton of damage, and they're tier'd and not just linear gains

135k/6kac at 110 is a bit low - even f2p you can do 110 tradable gear in each slot which should take you over that. your main thing sounds like it is going to be 2 mercs just aren't what you need.

good news tho, you have a pally, should go check out ToV and get some undead slaying in
 

ChatWithThisName

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I don't think I've used a caster merc outside of glooming deep (tutorial zone).

From my experience in testing Wizards need love by EQ devs in general. They will add damage to the overall, just doubt it's as much as you would expect a wizard to add.

But as mentioned by Sic, mercs are not great. They lack the boost you get from having a real player. Perhaps it was always intended to be that way so as to make it painfully obvious that using a merc was not meant to be a direct replacement for a player so much as a way to keep you from twiddling your thumbs while waiting for a group, or for doing quests duo perhaps.

Real toons are 100% better than mercs. It's not even a question. I think your hardest decision is going to be going back and leveling up 3 real toons enough that they are in exp range of your now 110 pal/enc/mage, or even considering an entirely different group makeup.

Pal - great dps on undead, ench good at crowd control and can do DPS, but not really meant for that, mage - power house for damage / utility combo, really helps with other casters in the group with the ench/mag combo. You lack a proper healer (shaman/druid/cleric) a merc can get you by, but a real healer won't keep your group from venturing ever deeper into EQ. Choose 2 more DPS toons to go with the Mage. Potentially ones that would benefit from the enchanter/mage, like a necro (slow to start DPS, but once it gets going they are like a train. Can't stop, won't stop. and perhaps a bst (adds to mana that stacks with ench, introduces another pet, benefits from mod rods/clarity line etc. Building off the existing group I'd say it's a good group makeup, Pal/Enc/Clr/Mag/Nec/Bst
 
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you may want to try to swap to rogue-merc and check, if that improves your dps enought. I havn‘t used wizz-mercs since yesrs. My feeling is, that mercs are supposed to be much less effective than real players. Actually real rogues in most cases deal much more dps than real wizzards. On top of that the differences between real rogue to rogue-mercs have been much smaller than real wizzards to wizzard-mercs. This leads to my conclusion that rogue-mercs should outdps wizz-mercs by far.
Keeping scarecrow-illu on pets and meele/tank will help.
Autogrant-Aas are useful for survival, but as more as your aa-count increase as more you will notice, how much aas matter. From autogrant-aa to all useful-aa the difference for my feeling is massive.
 
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This is just me and I play totally off the wall from what others do. But honestly? EW and GNM were far too hard for me at 110. But I have never been able to play to my level and that is ok with me cause I don't belong to a gym where everyone grunts so I am not competitive as far as leveling goes. I take my time, have fun and really enjoy the game. Players were solo'ing Gribble and GNM and I was still going WTF??? So I backed down a bit and now pretty much decimate what ever I am fighting and now the game is fun. But we all have different ideas of fun.

Run with a tank merc, healer merc and melee dps merc. Hopefully paid. My crew is level 120 mostly and we did not get where we were without that tank and cleric merc. The dps rogue is give or take and I only use him if I don't want to run another alt in that spot.

Do you have any Heroic AA? If not start at COTF and do the progressions to get some.

At 110 go to Frontier Mountains and there are some good camps to practice named strategy. Anywhere really in FM will drop some good stuff.

EW is recommended level 110 min so its going to be hard to go anywhere at the min level for that zone and be perfect. Just like when EOK came out and level 95 was min level but you could not even get any of the quests in LCEA until level 100.
 
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Dec 23, 2020
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I have a fresh 6 pack, lvl 110 and geared with ToV T1 and non visible items from Griklor over and over. I went to OT for a test and I heard the Sabertooth laughing his ass off as he looted 6 toons. I knew it would be rough with no AA but damn! The weather is still too nice to pop a Krono to rectify the situation but none the less it was pretty funny.
 
Joined
Oct 12, 2015
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Been playing mostly TLP's the last few years but I thought I would give Live a try again. I've been boxing lvl 110 - Pal, Enc, Mag with Wiz, Wiz, Clr mercs and having some trouble. My DPS seems just awful. I'm wondering if there is something just obvious I am missing or are lvl 110+ mobs just filthy hard to kill fast? I'm mostly just bazaar geared but I wouldn't think it matters all that much as long as you have decent AA's (mostly autogranted) and the tank geared (approx 235K hp and 6K ac buffed). I fooled around killing undead goblins in East Wastes and it was pretty slow going so I researched other places to go.

So I went to GMM and tried the Darkness Howls group mission. It was very slow but steady going until the named popped (Grash, Bloodmoon Growler - lvl 113). I could not whittle that guy down - I mean like 10+ minutes of fighting it and still not below 30% - slower than an old world raid boss. Even with Wiz mercs on burn (I always have them on burn and never have aggro issues) the DPS just sucked. Eventually your merc healer is just going to miss once, and the tank goes down when a fight is that long. Mage and Mercs were out of mana and Paladin had blown just about every trick to stay alive. Wiped when Grash was about 10% - but it must have been well over 15 minutes of fighting. Altogether, it took me a good 90 minutes to just get that far into that mission to be quite disappointed in how ridiculously hard it was.

I'm not sure at all what I am doing wrong, or is the game just this much harder on Live than, say a Gates of Discord group mini?

Thanks for any advice.
As I read your post, the one thought I had was, what do you want from the game? Are you caught up entirely? Do you want to mess around with end game content?

That said, I would start with deciding what you truly want out of the game. That will help determine what you need to execute the level of play with your 110 crew and its DPS. 110 can be a TON of fun and you can do a TON of the game content as free to play, without ever stepping foot in 110 mob level content. EOK and earlier content will help get you caught up in gear, heroic stat achieves, a familiar, etc. And you can use /bazaar free to play gear to do it.

That is the route I would start with. I'm lazy and TOV 110 free to play gear is accessible via the /bazaar; however, if you want to PLAY your crew and learn the game, I would play the catch up content and then land in Frontier Mountains, the named there drop free to play 105 gear, so you don't have to buy it via the /bazaar. Even with 110 toons in 105 free to play gear, you can do most of the EOK and lower content to catch up and gear up and whatnot.

If you plan on pushing end game content, then I think some of the suggestions with changing up your group setup is important to successfully enjoy moving forward. I would say that running a 6-man crew with MQ is the way to go over mercs, but if you're going to use mercs, then I echo tank,healer,rogue merc choices over the caster... I would make sure with your 3 PCs you cover the other buffs you're missing i.e. a shaman/BL (heals/dps/buffs) , ench/bard (ench/sham can double invis, but bard can do it by himself, while providing buffs/songs/auras to the crew), and then I always suggest a PC tank (an SK more specifically if you're 3-PC 3-Merc'ing (then healer, 2x Rogue Merc instead)) because they are just HANDS DOWN going to better than the merc tank, more important the SK hands down just has the best utility for group content players, like myself.

Anyhow, I wish you the best moving forward!

Just my two [red] cents.
 

Hulkman

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The higher level content (latest expansion) has a few named that are very difficult and seem to ramp up as the fight goes longer. Your damage output is very very important and key to be victorious consistently. The Mercenaries are basically useless for DPS and the only Mercenary I use is a healer if I have no choice.

Best bet is to group with fellow players or save every disc/burn/special item ability when taking on a named and hope you can tough it out. But remember you cannot control your surroundings always and may risk adds or pathing mobs or even glitches.

Have fun and take it easy exploring what you can handle and what you cant
 
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Don't forget that level 100 heroic characters were promised for September, so that might save some catching up if you decide to replace mercs.
I have a feeling it's going to cost more to buy the 100 Heroic (other than them including EVERYTHING 85-100 done) than it would be to just PLVL a toon from 85-100 (because it's really quick esp. with a new heroic 85 who has LOTD up :P)... (though I know people are going to argue it here, but until the 100 heroic actually happens, I would NOT bother waiting... heroic it, pay someone to get 100 really quick and jump in and get started)

Just my two [red] cents.
 
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I used to merc my empty slots and then I decided if I am boxing 2 why not 6. Like Sic mentioned a toon is always going to be better than a merc.

I especially like the advice of backtracking to lower content. ToV was fresh when I came back to the game after a few years off and when I got 110 i took my pally, who had about 25k AA at the time into EW and got swatted like a horsefly. It took me a while to go back and start doing that content. I needed gear and AAs.

If you are really just looking to power your way into end game group content you are going to be disappointed. You are going to need about 10k AA per toon and some better gear. I currently run Pal, bard /enc, zerk x3, clr / shm as my 6. As you see i can change out the healers and the CC'ers. I personally prefer the enc, but that is because I have zero clue on what the bard is doing or how to play one. This makeup has allowed me to do all current content with the exception of the group missions. Only 2 of my 6 are usually paid, although all 6 are paid right now.

Like Ihcrumb stated set a goal and work towards that.
 
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Thank you all for your replies! Some great suggestions! I've been playing EQ since 1999 (I'm 53 yo). I started out playing a paladin on Bristlebane and raided hardcore until about 2004. A history of my playing would take up pages, but in summarization; I single boxed one account for the first dozen or so years I played EQ. I started boxing the atl-tab method on Lockjaw with 3 toons before I ever knew anything about MQ2. I started Rizlona at launch and boxed 3 toons alt-tabbing but joined a top raid guild. I got turned on to Redguides and have been using MQ2 at a novice level since. On Rizlona I subbed 6 accounts. With less playtime now that I am older, I really enjoy just being able to jump in the game with a full group - on my own schedule - take AFK's without bothering anyone, etc.

However, with a group of 6 paid accounts and using the program(s), I find I spend more time just fixing ini's, re-organizing spells/equipment, hot bars etc. each couple of levels than I do just playing. I waffle between wanting to just play one account and also wanting to run my own group. A sort of compromise has been playing on Live so I can use 3 paid accounts and 3 mercs. Until, that is, I run into problems like my OP.

I haven't tried 3 paid accounts and 3 free accounts (or some combination) because I get into that area where I'm managing 6 ini's and spellbooks, hot bars etc. - which takes up almost all my available time to play. I don't have a problem paying for 6 accounts (or even more) - my budgetary concern is my "time".

So, I've been trying to weigh all the pro's and con's of the choices at hand. With most of my experience over the last decade being played on TLP's, the Live game is far more complicated and I don't know a fraction of the game like I use to. It's both exciting and overwhelming. Do I even have the time to learn the game much less try and catch up? Do I spend all my time planning and preparing and getting to know the programs? Setting up and maintaining 6 different accounts which can take lots of time - or run with some mercs? Or just take chances with one account and go LFG everyday when I log on? Do I play TLP, FV, or another Live server? Sell Krono to buy gear? Or just try and enjoy the level 85 - 115 grind at a snails pace knowing I'll never really "catch up"?

I'm not so sure what my "goals" are. Last month I started playing my 3 - lvl 95's on FV with 3 mercs and it was pretty fun and easy and getting gear in FV is just so much easier and one less thing to have to worry about. The grind was pretty easy going with Pal/Enc/Dru and wiz, wiz, clr mercs. Then I saw that Daybreak was going to do a level 100 heroic offer in September, so I thought, maybe I'll just wait and jump on that train and start over. Then I remembered I had 3 lvl 110's on Bristlebane... so I started playing those again last week. Then the realization of my predicament of this OP hit me. What a difference between level 95's and 110's and the play of the mercenaries! - like completely different games!

Reading these replies and suggestions have been extremely helpful and have provided a lot of food for thought. Has anyone else gone through this same sort of thought process and what did you decide?

Thanks again!
 
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Mages stack more than well. My basic team includes 3 Mages; have been 4 Mages before I decidedd to need a real Tank. If you only add further mages to your team, the need to sustain more inis will not appear. 3-4 Mages can do a great job with identical inis.
 
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If you are struggling with .ini's and spending a ton of time working on setting up your toons then you are in luck. CWTN class plugins are exactly what you need. CWTN has done all of the work for you and has made boxing damn near fool proof. There is a yearly cost of $20 per class plugin, but imo if you can afford it that is the money well spent. I used to have sk, enc, clr, bst, shm versions, but since I prefer pally I let the SK fall off and enc recently lapsed as well. I can't afford to renew that one right now so I am stuck using a bard (no plugin for that, and I hate bards).

As for setting up spell bars and whatnot you really don't have to do that at all on the boxed toons. Setting up .ini's can be daunting and take a long time, but you can usually find a .ini for your lvl range if you choose to go the cheaper route and not get CWTN's plugin. No I don't get paid for promoting them, but they are really that good.

If you look at Sic's signature box you will see he has links to all kinds of resources that he shares. Take a look at his hotkeys and use them and modify them to your needs. Just don't make the mistake that I made. I watched Sic's video and saw how easy he made things look and I said cool I can run 6 toons and do that. His toons are better AA'd and his makeup is designed for what he does, any slight deviation from that makes the whole experience different. A pally tanks differently than an sk. I am, however, very happy with my 6 toons.

I can't speak for your server, but do NOT waste your time LFG. Run your boxes and then do LFG if you find a group drop the 5 boxes and go have fun. I play on 3 different servers and when I log in and LFG for 10-15 minutes I get upset because that is 10-15 minutes I could have been doing something I needed done.
 
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I can't speak for your server, but do NOT waste your time LFG. Run your boxes and then do LFG if you find a group drop the 5 boxes and go have fun. I play on 3 different servers and when I log in and LFG for 10-15 minutes I get upset because that is 10-15 minutes I could have been doing something I needed done.
@Turaj Steelfist AGREED 100%, most of us that box is not necessarily about the money; especially those of that have been around for 20+ years on this game, it is about the TIME we invest in the game now versus the other priorities in our lives (kids, jobs, further education, etc.); we still want to enjoy the game, but don't have the time to wait in LFG to get stuff done...

Just my two [red] cents.
 
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Agree with all above- The last expansion I purchase was Empires of Kunark. Not really sure how far/deep zone wide I can go now only to TBL? However, there is so much to do and so little time. With all that I have read up here on the site. Definitely start the overseer quest. Go back and get Heroic Quest done, Stop the lvling process at 110 and max out aa (thank goodness I am maxxed out at 105). Challenge or pick your poison. I have never really been a quester but that is the direction the game is going. Go to the Plane of War and fight Rolf. To me the mobs look to be the same approx levels as the mobs located in the Empire of Kunark.
The question will I get the same exp in the Plane of War as I would EOK? Realistically I want to get power 4 item for my team and leave.

The last power Item I got was Circle of Power 1 from name Unsuspected Striker

..
 
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Another vote for you to give CWTN's goods a try. I also was spending a ton of time on fiddling with KA ini's which wasn't all that enjoyable vs actually playing. I know some people really enjoy the challenge of tweaking ini's to perfection..I just wasn't one of them. CWTN's stuff is out of the box ready to roll....no tweaking needed. There are lots of options in the plugs but the default settings get the job done for most normal stuff with near perfection. And give Grind a try if you haven't already...another masterpiece and both Grind and the CWTN plugs come with great support. And seeing Sic et al answer the same question for the 29,000th time (I am guilty of this lol) without making you feel like a tool or a fool is one of the highlights of these forums :)
 

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