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Question - Another SK or Warrior thread (1 Viewer)

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Sorry to beat a dead horse on this one guys...my war is mostly cov T2 geared. I know many folks prefer SK’s, I’ve got one that’s 110 atm and I’m thinking of switching him to main.

Is the SK preferred just for more AOE taunts or is it really that much of a difference in survivability? I run a shaman heal FYI. Ty!
 

Sic

Nihil ᛗ
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imo if you don't already have a pref, I would say sk - they just have a very appropriate toolkit for boxing

both are viable, however
 
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For me its just the self survivability of the SK. If I parse the heals, my SK can heal itself for over 50% of the needed heals per mob and I use a shammy as the healer. I am sure the WAR is a great tank. I have friends that use it but the SK just makes it easier, at least for me.
 

Many_Whelps

WoW was the first MMO
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Do you plan to do anything other than box your own 6 character group? SK are a dime a dozen in the modern game. Warriors, not so much. Raid guilds are more likely to be recruiting warriors over sk.

For just boxing by yourself, it makes very little difference, play what you find fun.
 
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All things equal, SK is stronger overall in group game. Warrior probably has higher DPS potential if you have a fully synergized group, but unless it's your main or you prefer the play style - I'd +1 the SK vote from others. SK just has a ridiculous toolkit in the current game.
 
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I have all 3. Overall SK is the most consistent and strongest in group (even in raid gear) due to epic. Pally dpS on undead is well outright rediculous almost ber level.

And then war is rediculous for how long you can run various defensives.

Because SK can self heal though he more or less beats the others for big game tanking outside of maybe big trains (epic is good but i think war defensive is better at this point). IN fact I ran the war when I was farming ores originall because it was easier to pull a train and tank like 10-11.
 
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I like both myself. I put my SHD in a group with a SHM as I feel that SHD's taps and such can make up for any differences between a SHM and CLR (this probably isn't necessary these days, I just came back about a year ago and still have a mental block from 15 years ago when SHM wasn't as adept a healer as CLR). My WAR is in a group with a CLR.
 
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Have you taken the EQWarrior Wonderlic test? You need a high natural aptitude to play a warrior, so you shouldn’t get your hopes up. You should have a corporal APM rate of at least 240. A nonpareil warrior must have a butthole-hair-sensitive reaction time, so most people opt for SKs.
 
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Optimal DPS group, let's kill shit and move on. SK, Shm, Brd, Rog, Zrk, Bst or SK, Shm, Brd, Zrk, Zrk, Bst

Optimal Can't touch this group, you will never kill me, we do EVERYTHING well.... SK, Shm, Brd, Rog, Zrk, Clr
 
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All comes down to how well you play the toon and what suits your play style.

I don't really have any issues with agro as a Warrior, singles or multiples... And I've usually got a Necro friend or two with me dotting everything.

If, like many, you don't use all the tools available to you, the tank won't be much cop, regardless of class
 
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warrior if you want to tank, sk if you want to cast. war is easier to maintain agro and locks with 1 button push. discs are fantastic on a war. sk use taps to mitigate. depends on style of play im warrior all the way. simply because i want a tank not a caster.
 

Sum1

Warriors are inferior (read: crybaby) tanks
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I love my SK. It’s gone from a “damn, I need a tank in this little box group I’m kinda starting” to “my main toon.” I can’t even count how many times I’ve had my group killing stuff, walked away from my desk for a few minutes, and came back to find the cleric dead but a very much alive and still killing/pulling SK. Between taps and all the life tap AA’s, the survivability is off the charts.
 
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warrior if you want to tank, sk if you want to cast. war is easier to maintain agro and locks with 1 button push. discs are fantastic on a war. sk use taps to mitigate. depends on style of play im warrior all the way. simply because i want a tank not a caster.
I’ll put money in SK with multibind can hold agro in both ST and AE better...
 
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Sorry to beat a dead horse on this one guys...my war is mostly cov T2 geared. I know many folks prefer SK’s, I’ve got one that’s 110 atm and I’m thinking of switching him to main.

Is the SK preferred just for more AOE taunts or is it really that much of a difference in survivability? I run a shaman heal FYI. Ty!
Both are fun, if you have a hybrid group (shm/brd) go SK. If you have pure group (enc/cleric) i'd go war.
 
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Been using a warrior, and with one merc healer that’s not even maxed out, he face tanks just about anything with minimal effort. With the right practice he tanks and hold aggro on multiple mobs with no sweat. Although ask me to be the one pushing the buttons and not have him running auto and I would fail miserably. Just too steep of a learning curve and maintenance to do anything else other than timing all the button pushing to keep things smooth. Can’t speak to the SK except that everyone seems to have one in their pocket.
 
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Been using a warrior, and with one merc healer that’s not even maxed out, he face tanks just about anything with minimal effort. With the right practice he tanks and hold aggro on multiple mobs with no sweat. Although ask me to be the one pushing the buttons and not have him running auto and I would fail miserably. Just too steep of a learning curve and maintenance to do anything else other than timing all the button pushing to keep things smooth. Can’t speak to the SK except that everyone seems to have one in their pocket.
Well...personal opinion...SK's are a little better at AOE aggro, but if you pair a war with cleric/enc FOR A GROUP SETTING...that basically cancels out all SK advantages. Wars AGAIN personal opinion are less spell dependent and have superior mitigation ability. It is one thing to heal yourself with procs/spells...it is even better to get hit less and when you do get hit to get significantly less damage consistently...just my two cents.
 
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My cat can probably run my sk and survive most content. Once you have your AA and have self buffs on you don't need to actively life tap anything but the toughest content. I only have a healer for the rest of the party.
 

Sum1

Warriors are inferior (read: crybaby) tanks
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Well...personal opinion...SK's are a little better at AOE aggro, but if you pair a war with cleric/enc FOR A GROUP SETTING...that basically cancels out all SK advantages. Wars AGAIN personal opinion are less spell dependent and have superior mitigation ability. It is one thing to heal yourself with procs/spells...it is even better to get hit less and when you do get hit to get significantly less damage consistently...just my two cents.
The only time in groups or in raids a warrior can pull agro from me is when they’re actively trying, and only on one mob. Meanwhile, I can agro (and hold it) on the respawn that popped on the group/raid, and also pull in the wanderer that walked up my rogue’s ass without ever changing targets from my current target. At any given time I have at least four aoe agro abilities (some on very short/no cool downs) on my spell bar or aa’s on my hotbar that I can throw down.

I will admit to never really learning the warrior class. I tried, and even PL’d and geared one during EoK to try to become more proficient, but no matter what I did, I could never get him to the point where I thought it was an equal or a superior tank in the group game.
 
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Warrior have Confluent Expanse disc, we can keep the buff up pretty much indefinitely if we choose... as long as we're getting healed, we're pumping AE hate into all surrounding mobs (along with passive AA that do the same thing each time we get hit).

As long as other group members aren't being complete and utter dickwads, there is no problem.

SK AE agro is of course better, but it's kinda like chopping carrots with a chainsaw
 
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My SK is CoV T3 group geared, ToV/CoV type 5 dex and fully updated on type 7s. With Rk ll spells, a warrior has to be actively trying (probably 2h too) to beat me on just the main target when I’m SnB. If I’m 2h too, there’s zero chance they’re ripping off without discs that actively force target.
 
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My SK is CoV T3 group geared, ToV/CoV type 5 dex and fully updated on type 7s. With Rk ll spells, a warrior has to be actively trying (probably 2h too) to beat me on just the main target when I’m SnB. If I’m 2h too, there’s zero chance they’re ripping off without discs that actively force target.
Valid point in regards to aggro. I still think warriors handle damage mitigation better in encounters. Not arguing that SK's can self heals, tap, aoe aggro etc...but from a...pure tank (no finger waggling/clicky dependency) aspect i prefer war. Also...once geared war will work with standard (or upgrade disciplines really well). SK's you have to get epics, etc...which goes agaisn't my minimalistic approach to box chars.

Yes...you could sink days, weeks, months into making a SK an amazing tank...or I could just roll a war, buy spells, and tank. To me it's like the Mage vs. Berzerker argument...can they both dmg yes...will one do it better than the other if you sink time/effort money...yes....question is for a box crew...do you want to?

Also...cost wise...on my server warrior stuff is dirt cheap vs. SK stuff is expensive because everyone is rolling them now...so i'll take the savings in plat & time for a box toon.

Now for a main, it's about even. I have a high end war and a high end sk...they both have their pro's/cons but simplicity in my book trumps complexity.
 
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@fohpo you havent played a warrior have you? i dont macro my war but i can guarantee ill hold agro better than a sk and can take it from any sk. the reason being, they hold agro and they mitigate damage. thats all they do and they are the best at it. you can take a war on rank 2 discs and they can out agro a sk
 
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I have a max/max full tov raid War, and 2 max/max tov raid SKs.. War wins agro hands down and its not even close (SKs get challenged by a full burn zerker, War is like, oh you got to a 2). As far as effective tanks, SKs do better in group (LTs and runes/shields) then the war. Both have uses, if your group focused, the SK is the better route imo.
 

Sum1

Warriors are inferior (read: crybaby) tanks
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Warrior have Confluent Expanse disc, we can keep the buff up pretty much indefinitely if we choose... as long as we're getting healed, we're pumping AE hate into all surrounding mobs (along with passive AA that do the same thing each time we get hit).

As long as other group members aren't being complete and utter dickwads, there is no problem.

SK AE agro is of course better, but it's kinda like chopping carrots with a chainsaw
*shrug* SK's get the same buff (healing = ae hate/lifetaps)

Warriors are better tanks, if you line up the Warrior and the SK and ask them to do nothing BUT stand there in front of a single mob and take a hit. If you want the toon to do literally anything else besides that, the luster of the warrior (for me anyway) tarnishes pretty quickly. I'm very biased, though.
 

Many_Whelps

WoW was the first MMO
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Group content is not challenging enough to make either stand out over the other. All 3 tank classes can do the job just fine provided they are adequately geared. It literally doesn't matter in the least if the scope of the discussion is holding a camp in a static zone and killing random mobs. The differences in strengths and weaknesses of the classes only comes to light when you enter the raid game.
 
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Group content is not challenging enough to make either stand out over the other. All 3 tank classes can do the job just fine provided they are adequately geared. It literally doesn't matter in the least if the scope of the discussion is holding a camp in a static zone and killing random mobs. The differences in strengths and weaknesses of the classes only comes to light when you enter the raid game.
I dunno, I can think of major way Warrior can stand out.

Even with sub-par gear, they can tank well if they know what they're doing. 100% uptime of some form of damage mitigation ability covers a multitude of sins in the gear department.

Knights cannot do that.

Each class has their Niche
 
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I love my SK. It’s gone from a “damn, I need a tank in this little box group I’m kinda starting” to “my main toon.” I can’t even count how many times I’ve had my group killing stuff, walked away from my desk for a few minutes, and came back to find the cleric dead but a very much alive and still killing/pulling SK. Between taps and all the life tap AA’s, the survivability is off the charts.
I have 2 groups in different picks of the same zone. I have literally had 2 clerics and a druid grouped with my warrior (I have extra toons so I might as well use them, right?) while all the dps is out of group, and I'll switch back and forth between groups keeping an eye on things. Next thing I know is the warrior group has totally wiped, which is mind boggling with 3 healers and a 5 zerk out of group killing things quickly.

I regularly have my cleric in the other group (the only healer) gate back to pok for things and just leave the SK to survive on his own until I get back. He never goes down.

Just saying.

Edit: All of my toons are using CWTN plugins, which I love.
 
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@Ninjapickle not sure whats wrong but the war should never have that problem. make him agro more or get better equipment. i see posts like this all the time, then a brag about a sk surviving. well if the sk could have held agro the group wouldn't have died. i dont macro my warrior at all i very rarely wipe. as a matter of fact i was well into my 100s the last warrior i raised recently before i wiped completely and into my 80s before i died once. i read in a post once that the macros play a sk better than a warrior, maybe thats the hang up over a subpar tank?

for instance when HoT came out i was in the courtyard tanking that yard trash at level 80 with terror infused gear, an sk and pally had to wait till 85 and have abstruce fully. VoA same just not as pronounced, they could tank there in raid gear from HoT or T4. its a continuing trend, sk and pallys need either levels or higher gear to tank "equal" to a warrior. the divide would even be farther if the sk and pally did not have the mitigation AA that they cried to get. that perma buff you get is a warrior ability when in sword and board and 2h. a dev wanted his sub par sk tank to be able to run with the big dogs so he added that to his toon. mysteriously it became part of their "swiss army knife" abilities.
 
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I have always played a war since before pok came out.. I started noticing everyone and their uncles had a SK and I always wanted to tell them to get a real tank... Well I recently started playing a SK and even with lesser beef of him I notice a huge difference in group content. The day I did Temple of Veeshan Hero mission and the whole group died, but the SK and Zerker and we managed to finish Aaryonar off at the last stage of the event.. At that moment I was sold on playing a SK...
 
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@Ninjapickle not sure whats wrong but the war should never have that problem. make him agro more or get better equipment. i see posts like this all the time, then a brag about a sk surviving. well if the sk could have held agro the group wouldn't have died. i dont macro my warrior at all i very rarely wipe. as a matter of fact i was well into my 100s the last warrior i raised recently before i wiped completely and into my 80s before i died once. i read in a post once that the macros play a sk better than a warrior, maybe thats the hang up over a subpar tank?

for instance when HoT came out i was in the courtyard tanking that yard trash at level 80 with terror infused gear, an sk and pally had to wait till 85 and have abstruce fully. VoA same just not as pronounced, they could tank there in raid gear from HoT or T4. its a continuing trend, sk and pallys need either levels or higher gear to tank "equal" to a warrior. the divide would even be farther if the sk and pally did not have the mitigation AA that they cried to get. that perma buff you get is a warrior ability when in sword and board and 2h. a dev wanted his sub par sk tank to be able to run with the big dogs so he added that to his toon. mysteriously it became part of their "swiss army knife" abilities.
IDK man. My Warrior is in full CoV T3 gear with raid wep and shield, and full augs. The only gear advantage my SK has is 8/8 ToV raid armor, which isn't a huge gain over the warriors gear. I don't have issues with the group dying and the sk being the only survivor, so no clue where that comes from. The only time my group dies is if the SK drops. Even then it's rare because the cleric gets him up so fast and he recovers. He never has aggro problems, even when in ST and that bad pull near the entrance pulls half the center room for a nice train. My sk tanks all of it without a shield and holds aggro on all of it fine.
I can only speak from my experience, as I really know little about warrior at all. If not for the CWTN plugin, I never would have even tried a warrior. I just know that my mostly comparably geared warrior dies easily 5 times as much as my SK, and the warrior has the extra healers. Both toons are way over geared for ST. Hell, with 3 healers, I should be able to tank with a damn enchanter.
Maybe you're right in that something is different with the plugin setup and I just don't know enough about warrior to fix it.
 
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@fohpo you havent played a warrior have you? i dont macro my war but i can guarantee ill hold agro better than a sk and can take it from any sk. the reason being, they hold agro and they mitigate damage. thats all they do and they are the best at it. you can take a war on rank 2 discs and they can out agro a sk
I’ve played every class at a competitive raid level over the years; in RoI, RotE, Valhallah, and more casual guilds. I’ve 6 boxed “Master of...” every expansion since TBM (CoV almost done*) was released. I’m not saying warriors are bad or that they can’t threat and the group will wipe. Just objectively, especially in a box scenario, SKs are objectively better/easier to maintain. Warriors really shine once you understand SPAs and rotating their defensives, and they’re capable of bigger swarm pulls assuming you have a good cleric and the right abilities. SKs can just do that kind of stuff more consistently in group content.

I’ll still put money on SK holding agro outside of abilities that force target swaps.
 
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I can play a warr in cov as a silver acct no issues except for HA (anyone can struggle w those even gold raid accts)
Sk i tend not to bother playing silver cause he struggles more

I have a general approach when using either tank (or a paly)
can he aggro, can he tank, can he survive (ill even consider can he dps<paly>), comfortably
If all those boxes are checked and kill times are similar (close), I'm set
For me there is no best
Its more like Yoda said , do or do not there is no try
I don't want to work harder, cut it close, squeak by, I either dominate or I don't anything less is crap

The whole well this one can aggro more (u either have aggro lock or u dont), means nothing to me
This one mitigates better..... If I can single heal preferably w a shaman and never med, not struggle and not just barely get by, Im set

If the pace is to my liking, what do I care that this one or that one can kill this or that mob a few seconds faster sometimes........

Probably like the Hodge Twins used to say "Do What evah da fuk ya wanna do" (look em up they rock)
In the end its not what everyone else likes its what YOU like
 
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Group content is not challenging enough to make either stand out over the other. All 3 tank classes can do the job just fine provided they are adequately geared. It literally doesn't matter in the least if the scope of the discussion is holding a camp in a static zone and killing random mobs. The differences in strengths and weaknesses of the classes only comes to light when you enter the raid game.
Or when you suck at everything else...lol. If you suck at pulling (like me) you'll wish you had a war, an enc, some mage pets and a cleric nearby...
 
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I can play a warr in cov as a silver acct no issues except for HA (anyone can struggle w those even gold raid accts)
Sk i tend not to bother playing silver cause he struggles more

I have a general approach when using either tank (or a paly)
can he aggro, can he tank, can he survive (ill even consider can he dps<paly>), comfortably
If all those boxes are checked and kill times are similar (close), I'm set
For me there is no best
Its more like Yoda said , do or do not there is no try
I don't want to work harder, cut it close, squeak by, I either dominate or I don't anything less is crap

The whole well this one can aggro more (u either have aggro lock or u dont), means nothing to me
This one mitigates better..... If I can single heal preferably w a shaman and never med, not struggle and not just barely get by, Im set

If the pace is to my liking, what do I care that this one or that one can kill this or that mob a few seconds faster sometimes........

Probably like the Hodge Twins used to say "Do What evah da fuk ya wanna do" (look em up they rock)
In the end its not what everyone else likes its what YOU like
Well said, end of day it it up to each person. My advice...try one of each and whichever one you like best...pay for. it is a FTP game after all.
 
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@fohpo when you say played, as in boxed? as in macroed? or really played? because i have played every tank i watch hp. a sk is a rollercoaster a pally is a little better and a warrior is steady as a rock. i rotate my disks/ aas i know when to hit various "oh shit" buttons, a macro just cant do that. if you have too many "oh shit" moments on a sk you just cant handle it. on a warrior i just hit another ability and just tank through it. the only reason knights tank as well as they do at all is because a dev plays one and wanted to do the "amazing" things a warrior does.

this being said, take a warrior at level 1 and a sk put both in cloth armor (if you can even do that any more) see who lives longest. see who tanks better and more targets. no tweaks. or raise a sk and dont get the sword and board aa or the 2hander. then test your tanking abilities. that will prove you could not tank till the dev wanted it on his sk. you will notice that warriors did not get heals or lifetaps because they did not need it.

@an_image well said in the overpull statement
 

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